NBC News - Iraq War - 2003-03-20 - 1:04 p.m. (E)
Channel: malgent
Transcript
Language: English (original, YouTube automatic captions)
[0:02] can't fully appreciate the magnitude of
[0:04] whatever budgetary challenges we face
[0:06] unless you know the cost of the war.
[0:08] That cost will be known to us later on.
[0:11] We thought about
[0:12] >> and good afternoon. I'm Holly Thompson.
[0:14] We are going to break away for local
[0:15] news now, but if military action
[0:18] develops overseas, we will go back to
[0:20] network. We will keep you posted of the
[0:22] very latest information out there. Now,
[0:24] we begin our channel 4 news at noon.
[0:26] Around the world, there is widespread
[0:28] criticism of the US attack on Iraq. The
[0:30] White House says while President Bush
[0:32] respects the opinion of critics, he
[0:34] remains very focused on disarming Saddam
[0:36] Hussein. Beverly Kirk joins us now with
[0:38] the very latest from the White House.
[0:42] President Bush this morning in the Oval
[0:44] Office meeting with Vice President
[0:46] Cheney, CIA Director George Tennant, and
[0:48] Chief of Staff Andrew Card and hearing
[0:51] the latest on military action in Iraq.
[0:53] The administration is still trying to
[0:55] determine whether Saddam Hussein
[0:57] survived the initial attack and whether
[0:59] a videotape of him is authentic. On
[1:01] Capitol Hill, lawmakers are also focused
[1:04] on the war.
[1:05] >> View of the military action taking place
[1:07] in Iraq. The Senate will consider today
[1:10] a resolution of support for President
[1:13] Bush and the troops.
[1:15] >> The president has made the decision. We
[1:17] support our men and women in uniform and
[1:19] their families and we are now looking to
[1:22] the next stage.
[1:24] At the New York Stock Exchange, a moment
[1:26] of silence to honor those fighting.
[1:30] >> But in the streets of Washington,
[1:32] anti-war demonstrators protested during
[1:34] the morning rush, even blocking traffic
[1:36] on a bridge.
[1:38] Overseas, harsh criticism from Russian
[1:40] President Vladimir Putin, who called the
[1:42] attack a great political mistake.
[1:45] >> France's Jacques Shurach says the
[1:47] conflict will have serious consequences
[1:49] for the future. As expected, support
[1:51] came from Great Britain.
[1:53] >> What we say is that the number of Iraqi
[1:56] lives saved by this military action will
[2:00] far exceed the number of people who
[2:02] sadly will be killed.
[2:05] >> The White House says President Bush
[2:06] understands the opposition, but remains
[2:08] undeterred in his commitment to
[2:10] liberating the Iraqi people from
[2:12] Saddam's control.
[2:14] >> And we are now going back to network
[2:15] coverage. Skies over Baghdad are
[2:17] lighting up.
[2:18] Go ahead Peter if you could hear me.
[2:20] This is Tom Roco.
[2:27] >> We are again just standing here on our
[2:29] balcony
[2:31] trying to figure out what is going on.
[2:33] But clearly a nervous city. 15 minutes
[2:36] ago air raid warnings. Now 5 minutes of
[2:39] anti-aircraft fire. In the distance we
[2:42] can see explosions of anti-aircraft
[2:44] weapons in the sky.
[2:56] Hello. Hello NBC. Do you hear us? Do you
[2:59] hear us here in Baghdad? Do you hear us
[3:00] here in Baghdad? We are not hearing
[3:03] anything.
[3:03] >> Yes, we do hear you in Baghdad.
[3:06] >> All right. Great.
[3:07] >> Just continue. Peter Arnett.
[3:09] >> Yeah. Yeah. Tom, that was my producer,
[3:11] Charles Poe. Very brave young man with
[3:14] my team here. As I said earlier, 15
[3:17] minutes ago, uh, warning sirens in
[3:20] Baghdad just the last 5 minutes, heavy
[3:23] anti-aircraft fire into the sky. Right
[3:26] now in the distance, we cannot hear the
[3:28] explosions, but we we we can't hear the
[3:30] explosions, but we can see multiple uh
[3:34] anti-aircraft explosions, rockets going
[3:36] into the sky. Uh, we don't hear the
[3:39] sounds of planes, but you hang on a
[3:41] minute. I'll check with my cameraman.
[3:43] >> All right. As you do that, uh, uh,
[3:46] Peter, I'm going to get an assessment of
[3:48] where some of our expert analysts are
[3:50] here, uh, General Michael Short and
[3:52] Monty Migs, uh, and others. Um, that
[3:57] appears to be an explosion that has
[3:59] occurred in the distance, uh, on the
[4:01] horizon. I'm not sure the direction
[4:03] there in Baghdad. It's a sprawling city.
[4:06] About 5 million people live in Baghdad.
[4:09] Quite an elegant city at one time, and
[4:11] portions of it remain that.
[4:13] Um, it's always a surprise to a lot of
[4:16] outsiders. It's the most developed
[4:17] middle class in the Middle East
[4:20] probably.
[4:21] And the most striking architecture, of
[4:24] course, are all the presidential palaces
[4:26] and the monuments that Saddam Hussein
[4:27] has had erected to himself.
[4:30] Although in recent years, he's also
[4:34] erected what he called the mother of all
[4:35] mosques as he tries to reach out to the
[4:38] faithful in the Middle East and portray
[4:41] himself as a much more religious man.
[4:43] When he appeared this morning on
[4:44] television in Iraq, he referred to the
[4:47] Quran and morning prayers, but he is
[4:49] widely seen even in that part of the
[4:51] world as a very secular figure. He uses
[4:54] religion only when it's to his
[4:56] advantage.
[4:58] Okay, let's hear uh Peter Arnett again.
[5:02] >> Again, multiple anti-aircraft bursts
[5:05] sweeping ground. Now we hear the sounds
[5:07] of aircraft low over the city. Aircraft
[5:11] low over the city.
[5:14] Big explosion
[5:16] near the presidential palace. You will
[5:18] hear those explosions now.
[5:22] It looks somewhere near the information
[5:24] for the street. Explosion. Much smoke in
[5:27] the sky. Much smoke in the sky.
[5:36] It is clear the major attack is
[5:38] beginning on the city. When the building
[5:40] is completely destroyed by a bomb again,
[5:43] the smoke uprising and another explosion
[5:47] we're hearing.
[5:53] We are here opposite the presidential
[5:55] palace. This is five or six miles from
[5:59] riverfront at which there are
[6:02] we are under the impression 5 to 10
[6:05] targets. But right now the one we do
[6:08] see.
[6:08] >> All right. As we listen to Peter Arnett
[6:10] reporting directly from a hotel room in
[6:12] Baghdad, we will tell you that at the
[6:14] Pentagon and at the White House, this is
[6:16] the beginning of a campaign of shock and
[6:19] awe. an unparalleled air attack designed
[6:22] to do great damage to the leadership of
[6:25] Iraq. Also to have an enormous
[6:27] psychological effect not only on the
[6:28] military but on the people of Iraq know
[6:30] that they cannot win this war. Ground
[6:33] troops, if they're not already moving,
[6:34] will be shortly from the south and
[6:37] Kuwait up toward Baghdad. Other troops
[6:40] could be arriving from the north.
[6:52] Uh NBC's Jim Mlashesky at the Pentagon.
[6:54] What can you tell us?
[6:55] >> Well, Tom, uh US military officials do
[6:58] tell NBC News that this is the beginning
[7:00] of the shock and awe campaign. According
[7:02] to one official, this is going to be the
[7:05] entire nine yards. Uh the initial plan
[7:09] for shock and awe uh had called for some
[7:13] 600 cruise missiles, thousands of bombs
[7:16] uh all aimed at military leadership
[7:18] targets, military infrastructure targets
[7:21] in and around Baghdad in the first 24 to
[7:24] 48 hours of any air war. It's unclear as
[7:28] to how soon uh the US military would
[7:31] start moving on the ground. We did see
[7:33] earlier artillery bar barges across the
[7:36] Kuwaiti border aimed at the 51st
[7:38] mechanized division of the Iraqi
[7:40] military in southern Iraq thought to be
[7:44] uh the toughest of the regular Iraqi
[7:46] military troops in the south. Uh the war
[7:49] is on and at full boore at this time. Uh
[7:53] and this bombing is expected to continue
[7:56] uh Tom for several hours. All right,
[8:00] thanks very much NBC Jim McClashesky. As
[8:02] we continue to look at these live
[8:03] pictures, the consortium of television
[8:06] agencies in Baghdad and Al Jazera,
[8:09] you'll see that Arabic logo in the upper
[8:11] right hand corner. That is the Arabic
[8:12] news channel service out of Gat. They
[8:15] have more correspondents and more
[8:16] cameras there than anyone smoke around
[8:18] some of the buildings, but the striking
[8:19] thing remains that the power still is
[8:22] on. in Baghdad. There was a lot of talk
[8:25] about a so-called Ebomb that would
[8:27] immobilize the electrical grid for Iraq
[8:30] and Baghdad. Um some question about
[8:32] whether that will be used because the
[8:34] United States, if and when it takes
[8:36] ownership of that country, will have to
[8:38] be able to deal with power and does not
[8:41] want to do any more damage than
[8:43] necessary uh to get Saddam Hussein uh to
[8:47] disarm his country and to leave. Let's
[8:49] go back to Peter Arnett now in Baghdad.
[8:51] Peter.
[8:53] Okay, Tom, for the last five minutes,
[8:55] calm in the city. There's no
[8:57] anti-aircraft fire we can see, but there
[8:59] were two large explosions within a mile
[9:01] of us. One, a large building near the
[9:04] information ministry. It could be the TV
[9:06] center. We can't quite identify it yet.
[9:09] Another one opposite us in the
[9:11] presidential palace area. I think it may
[9:14] be one of the intelligence department uh
[9:16] buildings. We are not sure. There was 10
[9:18] minutes of intense anti-aircraft fire.
[9:21] We heard the sound sound of lowflying
[9:23] planes and there was lot of activity way
[9:26] to the west of us where there could have
[9:28] been other bombing but as far as
[9:29] Baghdad's concerned right downtown two
[9:32] buildings destroyed so far Tom
[9:34] >> and Peter what about anti-aircraft fire
[9:37] air defense systems within the center of
[9:38] Baghdad were they activated as well?
[9:41] Interestingly enough, no, Tom. We
[9:43] basically saw the anti-aircraft
[9:46] essentially to the west and to the
[9:48] northwest. Uh, in terms of the actual
[9:50] center of Baghdad where we are, we did
[9:52] not notice much activity. Now, on the
[9:54] other hand, I just haven't literally
[9:56] seen many anti-aircraft weapons in this
[9:58] area. We presume that we're around. But
[10:01] I must say that in the first Gulf War,
[10:03] there was far greater use of
[10:04] anti-aircraft than we have tonight. It
[10:06] was just this total spectacular display
[10:09] in in Jan the morning of January 16,
[10:11] 1991. Much less effort here tonight.
[10:14] Minimal compared to what it was in 1991.
[10:17] Now whether the Iraqis feel that this
[10:19] has not been the main attack and whether
[10:21] these these planes coming in presumably
[10:24] stealth bombers coming at great speed
[10:26] hitting only two targets in the city may
[10:28] not have been enough.
[10:29] >> All right, you have been listening to uh
[10:31] Peter Arnett. We are now going to go
[10:33] live and talk with Channel 4's Ben
[10:36] Singer who has been with Camp Thunder,
[10:38] the 101st. He is joining us by phone.
[10:41] Ben, can you hear us?
[10:42] >> Can you hear us?
[10:43] >> Yes, I can. Go ahead,
[10:44] >> Ben. Go ahead and describe uh whatever
[10:46] you can without giving anything away. I
[10:48] understand you are with the troops on
[10:50] their way to Iraq, correct?
[10:53] >> Right. Well, that was the plan for
[10:54] today. As far as travel, it's sort of
[10:57] been suspended at this point as far as
[11:00] the troops at Camp Thunder are concerned
[11:01] because of the the missiles that were
[11:03] fired into Kuwait today. We're happy to
[11:05] report and they want us to report that
[11:06] no members of the 159th Aviation Brigade
[11:09] were hurt today. So, they want to make
[11:11] sure that message gets out to their
[11:12] family. Though, there were uh there was
[11:14] at least one missile that was targeted
[11:17] to hit this camp. So, a Patriot missile
[11:19] on site here did go up and destroy it in
[11:21] the air, causing a very loud explosion
[11:23] today, causing everybody to run to the
[11:25] survivability ch trenches and dawn their
[11:28] gas masks and other protective chemical
[11:30] gear. So, definitely some tense moments
[11:31] around here today.
[11:32] >> Oh, I can imagine. Describe what you can
[11:34] hear or see from your vantage point
[11:36] there.
[11:38] You know, as far as I I know, we're
[11:40] probably about an hour from the border,
[11:42] more west of Kuwait City, and we'll hear
[11:45] some of the low rumblings of what's and
[11:48] I think it's become apparent here that
[11:50] starting to talk about the dark, but we
[11:53] really can't see it from here. It is
[11:54] nightfall. I'm sure you just saw a
[11:56] picture of um you can't see it going on.
[11:59] You can hear very low rumblings probably
[12:01] likely from coming
[12:07] And obviously we are having some
[12:09] technical difficulties. We've been
[12:10] talking with Channel 4's Ben Singer
[12:12] who's been joining us by phone from Camp
[12:14] Thunder. Some good news for the folks uh
[12:16] talking about the 101st there from Fort
[12:19] Campbell. He is saying happy to report
[12:21] that no members of the 159th Brigade uh
[12:24] there with the ninth helicopter
[12:25] battalion have been injured. So some
[12:27] good news to report for our folks there
[12:29] at Fort Campbell. Now we're going to go
[12:30] back to network.
[12:32] >> A lot of activity going on. Well, if if
[12:33] the ground forces kicked off about the
[12:35] same time, uh that's going to be moving
[12:38] very quickly and uh the embedded
[12:40] reporters are going to be buttoned up
[12:41] and tracked moving. We won't hear from
[12:43] them for for a while.
[12:46] >> Okay, let's
[12:48] uh NBC's David Gregorus at the White
[12:50] House has some additional information
[12:51] for us. David
[12:52] >> Tom, senior officials telling us even as
[12:55] we look at these pictures, uh they are
[12:58] saying for the purpose of context that
[13:00] when Secretary Rumsfeld said that uh
[13:03] this period of attack would would be of
[13:05] a scope and size that has not been seen
[13:07] before. Uh that even the beginnings of
[13:10] this kind of assault that we're seeing
[13:12] unfold may get larger and larger still
[13:15] as it as it continues to unfold. that
[13:16] there is a an acceleration of battle
[13:19] plans that they have experienced since
[13:21] the original intelligence popped up that
[13:23] led to the first strike. There's also
[13:26] officials are telling us a good deal of
[13:28] dissemination of information still going
[13:30] on of leaflets and a good deal of
[13:32] assessment still going on from the
[13:34] original strike, the first surgical
[13:36] strike on Baghdad. Uh officials also
[13:39] saying that some of what we're seeing in
[13:41] terms of the ground campaign may still
[13:43] be on the level of softening of targets
[13:45] rather than the full-scale ground
[13:46] assault that we may see later on.
[13:48] >> All right, thank you very much David
[13:50] Gregory. Uh the bombing appears to be
[13:52] focused, I'm told, on the El Karkk
[13:54] district, home of the Iraqi elite, where
[13:56] the presidential secretary at the
[13:58] special security organization
[13:59] headquarters, the revolutionary command
[14:01] council, the Republican palace, the
[14:03] underground national command center,
[14:04] council of ministers, residences, and
[14:06] offices of all the key Iraqi leadership
[14:08] are located. Uh David Kay, who was a UN
[14:11] weapons inspector in Baghdad, and now an
[14:13] NBC News analyst, is very familiar with
[14:15] that neighborhood.
[14:16] >> This is a Tom the upscale area of
[14:19] Baghdad. uh a rare concentration of
[14:22] everything in a scope of probably no
[14:24] more than maybe 15 square miles. But
[14:26] you've got the hu one huge Republican
[14:29] palace which is the oldest palace
[14:31] actually in Baghdad in terms of its
[14:32] foundations. Uh but you've got
[14:35] intelligence uh headquarters there. Uh
[14:37] the interesting thing for Peter of
[14:39] course from the roof of the Palestine
[14:41] Hotel if he has anyone there he he has a
[14:43] great view of that area. You overlook it
[14:45] from the Palestine Hotel. This will be
[14:47] visible in terms of shock and awe. It'll
[14:50] be visible to all of Baghdad. There will
[14:53] be no doubt. This is a quarter of
[14:54] Baghdad that even the Iraqi minders I
[14:58] had didn't like to go into. You could
[15:00] see the hair stand up to them. They know
[15:03] this is a this is where the power was
[15:05] centered and some of the worst of the
[15:07] terrorist uh intelligence and police
[15:10] functions.
[15:12] >> All right, as a reminder, it's 9:20 p.m.
[15:15] in Baghdad. it um it's now um uh about
[15:20] 18 hours after the initial strike
[15:21] against the so-called target of
[15:22] opportunity, the leadership bunker from
[15:25] last night. Uh that got all of our
[15:27] attention very quickly. That was based
[15:30] on a report from George Tennith, the
[15:31] head of the CIA, who went to the
[15:33] president and said, "We think that we've
[15:34] identified a place where they're all
[15:36] gathering and uh may be gathering for
[15:38] morning prayers as well as a leadership
[15:40] meeting." The president signed the
[15:42] authorization to conduct the strike that
[15:44] occurred last night. The president went
[15:46] on the air and said, uh, Operation Iraqi
[15:49] Freedom is now officially underway, but
[15:52] in a much different fashion than anyone
[15:55] expected. Um, the war began not with a
[15:58] bang, but with exclamations of surprise.
[16:01] This appears to be now back to square
[16:04] one, the original battle plan. shock and
[16:07] awe in the skies uh over Iraq, the
[16:10] capital, and in the area south of there,
[16:12] defense installations, oil fields,
[16:15] places where the regular army has dug in
[16:18] and um if Donald Rumsfeld has its way,
[16:21] will turn in its weapons and turn its
[16:23] back on Saddam Hussein and become part
[16:26] of a new Iraq. Uh not much that we can
[16:29] do except to continue to bring you these
[16:31] pictures and wait for what we expect
[16:34] will be a next wave of attacks on the
[16:36] capital city, but we don't know exactly
[16:39] when that will occur because it's a
[16:41] closely integrated battle plan. Uh Peter
[16:44] Arnett, uh
[16:47] >> otherwise no traffic at all on the
[16:49] streets. A few people walking around in
[16:51] front of their houses. Another large
[16:54] explosion
[16:55] in the outskirts of Baghdad, probably to
[16:57] the northwest. Very loud explosion
[17:00] followed by intermittent anti-aircraft
[17:03] fire. Intermittent anti-aircraft fire
[17:05] >> out the direction of the airport. Peter
[17:06] >> attack coming in.
[17:10] This follows the pattern of the first
[17:11] Gulf War where about every 10 to 15
[17:14] minutes in the initial phase there were
[17:16] waves of missiles or planes hitting the
[17:18] city.
[17:20] All five minutes of attack, 10 15
[17:22] minutes delay,
[17:24] increase further attacks and more delay.
[17:30] >> Peter northwestern
[17:31] >> as I said earlier the anti-aircraft
[17:33] response from Baghdad much more limited
[17:35] than in the first cold war. Much more
[17:37] limited
[17:39] >> beyond the airport when you say
[17:40] northwest of the city.
[17:45] >> Are you sure?
[17:46] >> No question. All
[17:49] right, we're joined now by retired Air
[17:51] Force General Michael Short, who ran the
[17:53] bombing campaign against Kosovo. Uh,
[17:56] General, what do we think here? Do we
[17:58] have some tomahawks that are landing in
[18:00] the Baghdad area? Tom, I think a layown
[18:02] of air launch cruise missiles, uh,
[18:04] 2,000lb warhead penetrating capability,
[18:07] extraordinary explosive capability
[18:09] launched from B-52s, perhaps as many as
[18:11] 10 from the United Kingdom, and then sea
[18:13] launch missiles from submarines and
[18:16] destroyers and cruisers, probably a
[18:18] couple of British submarines in both the
[18:20] Gulf and the Red Sea. And I think in
[18:22] there in that mix, uh, B2s, I would
[18:25] guess as many as five or six with 16
[18:27] warheads a piece, uh, global positioning
[18:29] system guidance, and the 117s that we
[18:32] saw last night, too, over the target of
[18:34] opportunity. I'm guessing as many as 10
[18:36] tonight. And what they'll want to do is
[18:38] get those 117s in, back out again, turn
[18:41] them, and bring them in again. That's
[18:42] why we started just after darkness. We'd
[18:44] like to get two solid waves of stealth
[18:46] technology overhead tonight. You're a
[18:48] lot more comfortable with this than you
[18:49] were with last night when it was going
[18:51] to get
[18:52] >> I am. This is my business. Uh hitting
[18:54] one thing and seeing what happens. Was a
[18:56] great move. It was a brilliant move, but
[18:58] this is what's going to get their
[18:59] attention.
[19:00] >> They all understand this one. A lot of
[19:02] them didn't know that thing happened
[19:03] last night.
[19:05] >> Uh we're told that a huge plume of smoke
[19:07] could be seen from the west bank of the
[19:08] Tigris in central Baghdad, but it could
[19:11] not be determined what had been hit. But
[19:12] that would be in the area of one of the
[19:14] presidential palaces. That's in the area
[19:15] of one of the presidential palaces, but
[19:16] it also has an intelligence service
[19:18] building almost adjacent to it. So, they
[19:21] may may well have taken that out.
[19:22] >> All right. We're also told that F-14 and
[19:25] F18 jets have taken off from the Teddy
[19:28] Roosevelt. Absolutely. That's a
[19:29] principal carrier. Peter Arnett in
[19:31] Baghdad.
[19:32] >> Several other other targets including
[19:35] the Iraqi television uh station system
[19:38] which was a target in the first Gulf
[19:39] War. The information ministry was not a
[19:41] target in the second Gulf War. in in the
[19:43] first Gulf War. This time around has
[19:45] been very clear that many international
[19:47] media have been working out of there and
[19:49] they were we were working in the
[19:51] information ministry earlier today and
[19:53] uh but we cannot confirm that that is
[19:55] the target of the first bomb. It is
[19:58] certainly very near that that
[19:59] >> Peter Peter what about
[20:00] >> beyond that?
[20:02] >> Go ahead.
[20:04] >> Yep. Yep. Back to you Tom.
[20:06] >> No, I was just going to say are you
[20:07] seeing any damage uh to roadways and
[20:10] bridges? Uh those were targets in the
[20:12] past, but they're picking out, it sounds
[20:14] to me, like specific buildings.
[20:17] >> Clearly specific buildings. We have seen
[20:20] two that have been destroyed. We've
[20:21] heard explosions in two or three other
[20:23] areas. The presidential palace itself
[20:26] remains intact. One one building in the
[20:29] presidential compound has been
[20:31] destroyed. We did hear a major explosion
[20:34] to the south of to the southwest of that
[20:36] building. We can't eyeball it here from
[20:39] here. And clearly another one of the
[20:41] command and control structures. Clearly
[20:44] many targets to the western edge of the
[20:46] city because there was enormous
[20:47] anti-aircraft fire earlier away in the
[20:50] distance. Beyond that there are no other
[20:52] targets. The defense ministry intact
[20:54] communication centers on the east side
[20:56] of the river where we are so far unhit.
[20:59] So you don't have a similar pattern to
[21:01] the first Gulf War. Clearly they not at
[21:04] this point. But of course this is just
[21:06] the beginning of what is promises to be
[21:09] of course a huge bombing campaign. Tom
[21:12] >> and General Michael Short who is here
[21:14] with us. How does it work? They lay down
[21:16] the cruise missiles, the tomahawks and
[21:18] then the tacticals come in behind that.
[21:20] >> Tom, I think cruise missiles again air
[21:22] launched and sea launch to take out his
[21:24] eyes to blind the Iraqi air defense
[21:26] system so they cannot respond to either
[21:28] stealth assets or conventional assets.
[21:30] and rapidly after that, stealth assets,
[21:32] probably redundancy on some of the
[21:33] radars. As an air commander, I'd want to
[21:35] put a couple of rounds on each of the
[21:37] radars that I was most concerned about
[21:38] on their defensive systems. Then with
[21:40] stealth in and back out, then I put in
[21:42] conventional assets believing I've
[21:44] beaten them down enough that I can put
[21:46] aluminum airplanes overhead Baghdad.
[21:48] >> All right, let's go to NBC's Jim Mlvsky
[21:50] at the Pentagon who has some more on
[21:52] just what we've been talking about here.
[21:54] Jim,
[21:55] >> uh Tom, uh US government officials are
[21:58] are now describing a somewhat different
[22:00] plan than the huge massive uh
[22:03] bombardment of Baghdad uh in in what
[22:06] they would call the shock and awe
[22:08] campaign. That was the original campaign
[22:10] underway. Uh and I and I guess it could
[22:12] be best described perhaps as shock and
[22:16] pause. Uh it was suggested to us uh that
[22:19] there may be waves of air strikes now uh
[22:22] that are more incremental uh aimed at
[22:25] specific leadership targets as Peter
[22:28] Arnett described the areas being struck
[22:31] uh in this latest wave of air strikes uh
[22:33] from US warplanes and missiles. Uh those
[22:36] are aimed at at the Baghdad elite and
[22:39] leadership targets. Uh the according to
[22:42] officials uh the bombing last night
[22:44] aimed at at this bunker that supposedly
[22:47] contained Saddam Hussein and senior
[22:50] members of his regime. Uh that was a
[22:52] very direct message aimed at Saddam
[22:54] Hussein. That was followed up today uh
[22:57] by messages from both Secretary of
[22:58] Defense Rumsfeld and Ari Fleer during
[23:01] their briefings here in Washington.
[23:03] What's interesting about those briefings
[23:05] is that they are beamed into uh Iraq uh
[23:09] via airborne radio broadcasts uh through
[23:13] military aircraft. Uh and the message
[23:15] from both of them today was very strong.
[23:18] Essentially, give up while you've got
[23:20] the chance. Take down Saddam Hussein and
[23:23] avoid an all-out war. This is to these
[23:27] air strikes are apparently designed now
[23:29] to reinforce that latest message.
[23:32] Meanwhile, still no indication that
[23:34] despite the artillery barges uh being
[23:36] aimed across the border at the 51st
[23:38] mechanized unit in southern Iraq, uh
[23:41] that any of those ground troops uh have
[23:43] actually begun to move into uh the
[23:46] country of Iraq. Tom.
[23:47] >> All right, thanks very much NBC Jim
[23:49] Mlashesky. Kelly O'Donnell who is at
[23:51] Sentcom the central command headquarters
[23:53] in Gdderd is reporting the sources there
[23:55] are saying this may be going on for a
[23:57] period of unknown time but the assault
[24:00] that secretary Rumsfeld described
[24:01] earlier as a quote force scope and scale
[24:05] that has not been seen before will be
[24:08] unmistakable and this is not yet it. So
[24:11] the battlefield plan still is unfolding
[24:14] the exact dimensions of it are still not
[24:17] entirely clear to us. Um, General, uh,
[24:22] Monty Migs has been thinking a lot about
[24:24] shock and awe as a battlefield strategy
[24:26] and as a concept for the wars of the
[24:29] 21st century. General,
[24:30] >> well, I I think we got to be careful
[24:32] with words like huge. Remember what I
[24:36] think we're about here is using a lot of
[24:39] very small strikes to take out very
[24:43] specific pieces of the system in which
[24:46] the cumulative effect is devastating to
[24:49] the enemy's ability in any way to react
[24:51] or control his forces. And that's when
[24:54] his will starts to deteriorate. And so
[24:57] it's not a big bang uh type of attack.
[25:00] It from my assessment of it. It's more a
[25:02] series of small bangs that crescendo and
[25:05] then everything becomes paralyzed and
[25:07] the enemy starts to get frantic.
[25:08] >> All right, we're going to take a look at
[25:10] the tape that we saw earlier from
[25:11] Baghdad. Um,
[25:17] >> and I'm going to ask General Short to uh
[25:19] join in on this as well. In 1991, there
[25:22] was an awful lot of just filling the sky
[25:24] with anti-aircraft stuff. They didn't
[25:26] know quite what they were shooting at.
[25:28] They were just filling it up. Is that
[25:29] what it looks like here as well? It does
[25:30] to to me, Tom. This is the hope that
[25:32] we'll put enough lead in the sky and
[25:34] someone will fly through it. I I doubt
[25:36] that much of this is guided because to
[25:38] guide it, you've got to turn your radar
[25:39] on. And to turn your radar on in Baghdad
[25:41] today is to die because there are F-16s
[25:44] and F-18s with a harm and a radiation
[25:46] missile waiting for someone to turn
[25:48] their radars on.
[25:49] >> And back to what General Migs was just
[25:50] talking about, shock and awe, surgical
[25:53] strikes, first stage. Take a look, see
[25:56] what happens with the military command
[25:57] structure. Uh it also sends a message to
[25:59] the Iraqi people and they get a response
[26:02] not just militarily but maybe
[26:04] politically within the command
[26:05] structure. Right.
[26:06] >> That's right. And I think uh actually
[26:08] Secretary Rumsfeld's presentation today
[26:11] given the way that was paced and and uh
[26:13] focused directly as if he was talking to
[26:15] the Iraqi people wouldn't surprise me if
[26:18] uh it was up on Commando Solo and being
[26:20] pumped through all those uh one
[26:21] frequency radios as a as a part of this
[26:24] thing. I think we're sending the message
[26:26] clearly. We can hit whatever we want to
[26:28] hit whenever we want to hit it. Uh this
[26:30] is not something where we can only come
[26:31] at you for 2 hours. We'll only be here
[26:33] at night. I expect to see us bombing in
[26:35] the daytime after the first night of
[26:37] attacks. And as General Mig said, we
[26:38] will be selective. But the overall
[26:40] impact after about 24 hours, they've got
[26:43] to look around and say a lot of things
[26:45] that were dear to us are gone and we can
[26:47] do nothing about it.
[26:48] >> And at the same time, they're hearing in
[26:50] Arabic language on those one frequency
[26:52] radios. And uh when I've been in uh
[26:54] Baghdad, a lot of people do have
[26:56] shortwave radios as well. They're
[26:57] hearing uh the BBC and the Voice of
[27:00] America and uh other outlets and uh
[27:03] they're realizing that this time there
[27:06] is no exit strategy for
[27:07] >> Exactly. This isn't going to stop until
[27:09] you cause it to stop by removing your
[27:12] leadership.
[27:12] >> And the thing we often forget about
[27:14] these societies, the word gets around
[27:15] the street very very very quickly. We
[27:17] saw that in Bosnia. But the fact is that
[27:19] in this case, the people of Iraq, the
[27:22] general rank and file ordinary people
[27:25] have been powerless to deal with him
[27:26] because he is so tightly surrounded
[27:29] >> by a by his standards very sophisticated
[27:32] security apparatus.
[27:33] >> But I but I think Rumsfeld spoke to them
[27:34] when he said, "Don't go to work. Stay in
[27:36] your houses. We're not after you. We're
[27:38] after the leadership. And we're not
[27:40] going to bomb uh areas where we have
[27:41] large domestic populations." My guess is
[27:44] there will be some targets in in heavily
[27:46] populated areas that we will choose not
[27:48] to strike, although they would be of
[27:49] value because of the risk of arming
[27:51] civilians.
[27:52] >> We were just watching some more
[27:53] explosions there. This is a live
[27:55] pictures both from NBC and Al Jazera uh
[27:58] buildings in Baghdad going up as the
[28:01] attack continues. These Tomahawk
[28:04] missiles are really extraordinary
[28:06] weapons. Uh they'd make a right turn at
[28:08] the corner that they want to make a
[28:09] right turn at uh go up a little higher
[28:11] then go down lower and then just drop
[28:13] down.
[28:13] >> Exactly.
[28:14] >> And they become an unexpected and very
[28:16] violent visitor.
[28:17] >> Yes. And the same thing with the air
[28:18] launch cruise missile. They just
[28:20] >> How much better are they now than they
[28:21] were 10 years ago? The Tom Alex
[28:22] >> Tom. To me the biggest thing is they now
[28:24] have the global positioning system in
[28:25] it. Then the Navy has an option to shoot
[28:27] a 1,000lb unitary round or the cluster
[28:30] bombs that you and I discussed earlier.
[28:31] So they have a v variety of targets they
[28:33] can strike. In the past they had some
[28:35] trouble with hardened targets. not now
[28:36] with a,000lb penetrator and and the GPS
[28:39] guidance uh puts them right where they
[28:41] want to be.
[28:42] >> And what about the capacity of the
[28:43] Iraqis to defend against an incoming
[28:45] Tomahawk?
[28:45] >> No question. You can shoot it down with
[28:47] with AAA uh because they are visible.
[28:49] They are not supersonic. And you can you
[28:51] can to some degree predict the roots.
[28:54] So I think we we will lose some toa.
[28:56] There's no question about that.
[28:57] >> All right. That's a that's a launch of a
[28:59] tomahawk that we just watched there.
[29:00] That's how they uh take off. They fly.
[29:03] >> All right. We're going to continue to
[29:04] watch pictures, the network coverage
[29:06] there of uh the bombings going on now in
[29:09] Baghdad overseas. But we are going to
[29:11] talk with Channel 4's Ben Singer who is
[29:13] again joining us by phone from somewhere
[29:16] in Kuwait. Ben, can you hear me?
[29:18] >> Hear me?
[29:19] >> Yes, I can. Holly,
[29:20] >> now did I hear you correct a little
[29:22] earlier? You said you were about 1 hour
[29:24] from the Iraqi border and it sounded
[29:27] like your your unit was not moving. Is
[29:29] that correct?
[29:30] >> That is correct. Uh that is due to some
[29:32] the some the missiles that were fired
[29:33] into Kuwait earlier today. Part of the
[29:36] the group that I'm with has planned to
[29:37] to move a bit farther north, possibly
[29:40] even cross the border today, but plans
[29:42] have been sort of suspended as of right
[29:44] now. They're not really sure how safe it
[29:46] is out there. And of course, they're
[29:48] letting the the air attack take its
[29:50] course and kind of see what's left after
[29:51] that.
[29:52] >> Well, can you kind of describe what you
[29:54] and the troops are going through right
[29:56] now? Are you wearing your chemical suits
[29:57] or your gas masks?
[29:59] >> We are. It's certainly been a a very
[30:01] tense day as far as that is concerned.
[30:03] There have been several warnings for us
[30:05] to to go in. The call is called
[30:06] lightning. Someone from brigade will
[30:08] call out lightning and everyone is
[30:09] expected to dawn their their chemical
[30:11] masks in 9 seconds or less and run to
[30:13] the survivability trenches and put on
[30:15] these chemical suits that are lined with
[30:17] charcoal so they can prevent from or
[30:19] protect from nuclear, biological or
[30:20] chemical weapons that may be any
[30:22] warheads coming in. And we only saw one
[30:25] explode sort of about 15 km away from us
[30:28] today. was headed here and a Patriot
[30:31] missile that is based at Camp Thunder
[30:32] did destroy it. But there were several
[30:34] other alerts after that, probably about
[30:37] six. And uh we're talking about the
[30:39] middle of the day here in this heavy
[30:41] gear sitting in trenches with gas masks
[30:43] on. It's extremely hot. It was quite
[30:46] frankly extremely uncomfortable. So I
[30:48] know a lot of us are expected to we're
[30:50] still dawning the suits. Not our masks
[30:52] in particular, but but everyone will
[30:54] will head to bed with this chemical gear
[30:57] on tonight. is not quite sure about when
[31:00] the next missile might be flying this
[31:01] way.
[31:02] >> Ben, I can imagine this is obviously a
[31:04] very tense time for you and the troops
[31:06] there. What is the mood among the
[31:09] soldiers?
[31:10] >> Well, I think you know there's a little
[31:12] bit of disappointment because there were
[31:14] plans to to get underway with certain
[31:16] things today and it was was really sort
[31:18] of a setback. You know, for for a lot of
[31:19] the people, you know, they they train to
[31:21] do these sort of things all the time.
[31:23] So, a lot of the soldiers for say
[31:24] weren't necessarily phased by it. you
[31:26] know, a few did care to share with me
[31:28] that they were a little concerned about
[31:30] any chemicals that may be flying this
[31:32] way, but the reports have come back
[31:33] negative as far as that is concerned.
[31:35] So, really, everybody's just exhausted.
[31:37] I mean, we're walking around with all
[31:39] this extra gear, especially in, you
[31:40] know, in the middle of the day like it
[31:41] was hours ago. It's just not an easy
[31:44] thing to do.
[31:45] >> Now, I want to remind the folks at home
[31:47] again, Ben Singer is with Camp Thunder,
[31:49] the uh 9th Helicopter Battalion of the
[31:51] 159th Brigade. Ben, how isolated though
[31:54] are you as far as hearing about what's
[31:57] happening, what's going on around you?
[32:00] >> Actually, there is one tent, the command
[32:02] tent here at Camp Thunder that does have
[32:04] access to to TV of some kind. I believe
[32:07] they're watching a cable news broadcast.
[32:10] So, really, ironically, they're sort of
[32:12] getting their information from from
[32:13] cable news right now and then sort of
[32:15] filtering it down the rank. they're
[32:16] getting a little bit from from other
[32:18] aspects or other um leaders in the army
[32:21] as well, but really that that's really
[32:23] the only outlet and then everyone has
[32:25] access to that. It's only the higher up
[32:27] the colonels and and the captains that
[32:29] are kind of in charge of the brigades
[32:30] here. So really the average soldier just
[32:33] has to kind of go on a blind base that
[32:34] they're being,
[32:37] you know, to do the right thing.
[32:40] Uh Ben, I know that earlier when we were
[32:42] talking, you said uh you did had some
[32:43] good news, actually great news to
[32:45] report, and that is that no members of
[32:47] the 159th Brigade have been injured. Are
[32:49] you hearing if there have been any
[32:51] American casualties?
[32:54] >> We haven't heard uh thankfully we
[32:55] haven't heard anything of that sort so
[32:57] far. And people really want us to relay
[32:59] that message to all the folks back at
[33:01] home, especially the family members
[33:02] sitting up there at Fort Campbell
[33:03] because these soldiers have not been
[33:06] able, you know, many of the soldiers
[33:07] that I'm with have moved from from camp
[33:10] to camp to camp. So, they have not many
[33:12] of them have not called home and told
[33:14] their loved ones how they're doing or
[33:15] even been able to check in. A few of
[33:17] them are starting to receive mail right
[33:18] now, but they're they're really sort of
[33:20] cut off from the rest of the world. So
[33:21] they wanted to make sure we tell our
[33:22] families that they're okay and they're
[33:24] and I guess as good a spirit as can be
[33:26] expected in a time like this.
[33:28] >> And Ben, we know this latest round of of
[33:30] attacks began probably I guess about 30
[33:32] 40 minutes ago and uh by the people
[33:35] here, military officials that's being
[33:37] called the shock and awe campaign.
[33:39] basically an overwhelming military
[33:41] strategy to uh finally get it underway
[33:43] and be bombing uh both Baghdad and other
[33:46] strategic uh sites there throughout uh
[33:49] the country of Iraq. But uh what are you
[33:52] hearing? Anything in that nature about
[33:55] any other attacks or any news at all?
[33:59] >> Not specifically. Really all that we've
[34:01] got to go on right now besides the fact
[34:03] that we're aware that the air attack has
[34:05] has started. We really just hear low
[34:06] rumblings in the distance and actually
[34:08] you can feel it um through the ground as
[34:11] you're just walking around some of the
[34:12] strategic hits that have been going on.
[34:14] We understand that some of the some of
[34:15] the fire is coming from the Persian Gulf
[34:18] perhaps from naval ships. And one
[34:20] soldier was describing it to me how
[34:22] large artillery that comes off the ship
[34:24] there. You know, some of these uh
[34:26] missiles or whatever they're firing are
[34:28] as big as maybe a Volkswagen, you know,
[34:30] bug car. I think he was probably
[34:32] exaggerating a little bit, but he's
[34:33] trying to say that, you know, we
[34:35] shouldn't be surprised that we can hear
[34:37] that sort of action from this far away.
[34:39] >> Yeah, we are being told that apparently
[34:41] they're planning to use 600 cruise
[34:43] missiles, thousands of bombs. We know
[34:45] that F-14, F-18 jets have apparently
[34:48] been taking off from the USS Theodore
[34:49] Roosevelt there in the Eastern
[34:51] Mediterranean. Also, B2s and F-17s being
[34:54] used right now. Ben, do you have any
[34:57] news or any word as far as when your
[34:59] specific group might be planning to move
[35:02] out? I mean, are we talking within hours
[35:04] or another day?
[35:07] >> It's really sort of uh everything
[35:09] changes by the hour, if that's fair to
[35:11] say. I think at this point they do have
[35:13] some some crew members interested in
[35:15] setting up a fueling station for for the
[35:17] Blackhawk and Chinook helicopters.
[35:19] That's of course essential to what the
[35:21] 101st does, the aerosol, moving troops
[35:23] around. So really that's one of their
[35:25] concerns is getting that process
[35:26] underway, but there's really really no
[35:28] word about when that might happen right
[35:30] now. I think it's it's my guess anyway
[35:32] that they might wait for another day.
[35:35] >> Ben, we also know that uh many of the
[35:38] soldiers over there have been on this go
[35:40] effort ready to uh launch with their uh
[35:44] ground attack, air attack for that
[35:46] matter at at a moment's notice. And
[35:48] having said that, they have to have
[35:50] everything packed up and ready to move
[35:51] on. Where are you sleeping? What are
[35:54] folks doing about that? Are you all
[35:55] hiding out in dogouts or are you
[35:57] sleeping in a tent?
[36:00] >> At this point, we we do have tents here
[36:02] at Camp Thunder. It's a little um more
[36:04] austere than Camp Victory. That camp was
[36:06] quite established. But right now, people
[36:08] had packed up a lot of their things in
[36:10] preparation for a move. So really, we're
[36:12] just sleeping on cuffs now without
[36:14] without any of the uh
[36:17] things or other things with right now.
[36:19] From what we understand, when we move on
[36:21] or if they move north, uh the conditions
[36:23] will get even worse. We cannot expect to
[36:25] have tents right away or running water
[36:27] or any of those sort of things. Um so it
[36:30] it certainly will get harder to just do
[36:32] live and do basic day-to-day things.
[36:35] >> Ben, when you all do plan to leave that
[36:39] area there with Camp Thunder and heading
[36:41] north into the border area there with
[36:44] Iraq, what are the plans of um I guess
[36:47] transportation?
[36:49] via tank, trunk or other vehicle.
[36:53] >> From what we understand, there there
[36:55] will be a certain group of troops, not
[36:57] necessarily from the 101st, that will
[36:59] probably go in before the 101st would
[37:02] make it. Of course, the 101st travels by
[37:04] helicopter and also many of the many of
[37:06] the soldiers will will travel by convoy.
[37:08] The problem with that is this isn't
[37:10] necessarily an area where there are a
[37:13] lot of roads. So, that that whole travel
[37:14] process can be expected to to take a
[37:16] long time. really if you look at a map
[37:18] of the Iraq area, you won't see a lot of
[37:20] interstates particular and they don't
[37:22] necessarily go anywhere besides Baghdad.
[37:25] So I guess if if that's the goal, if
[37:26] that's our end result as far as this
[37:28] metal is concerned, I guess that's a
[37:30] good thing.
[37:32] >> You with the media and obviously there
[37:34] are many other journalists out there,
[37:36] would you be traveling right along with
[37:38] the troops as they move in?
[37:41] >> Yeah, that's correct. they've uh they've
[37:43] sort of been talking to us about how we
[37:45] feel about being this this close to the
[37:47] action and obviously we've sort of
[37:49] expressed that we'd like to to be right
[37:50] up there with them, but maybe not
[37:52] necessarily on the first wave of things.
[37:55] So, I really have to say that they've
[37:56] been taking very good care of us. They
[37:58] they realize that we're we're out here
[38:00] with about 1/100th of the training that
[38:02] they get to be here. They're very
[38:04] sensitive to that and they they're
[38:06] they're working they're doing their best
[38:08] to take care of us. Ben, obviously for
[38:10] you and for many of the soldiers out
[38:12] there, this is a first time at war. And
[38:15] you were talking, telling us earlier
[38:17] this morning, even in the morning show,
[38:18] how close that this apparent Scud
[38:20] missile of some sort that was uh flying
[38:23] in through um Iraq there, landing in
[38:26] Kuwait, firing there. How close this
[38:30] came to you? It was shot down by a
[38:32] Patriot missile. After that happened,
[38:35] how how panicked was everyone? Did
[38:37] everyone remain? I mean just tell us
[38:39] describe what the troops and you were
[38:40] going through.
[38:48] >> Obviously we're having some technical
[38:50] difficulties again. We have been talking
[38:52] with Channel 4's Ben Singer who is with
[38:54] Camp Thunder, the ninth helicopter
[38:56] battalion of the 159th Brigade who is
[38:59] there in Kuwait. He's telling us he's
[39:02] just about an hour from the border of
[39:04] Iraq and at this time his unit is uh
[39:07] basically camping out. They are sitting
[39:09] still. They are not moving. Apparently
[39:12] they are in uh near other fire zones
[39:17] because uh they do know in just recently
[39:19] throughout the morning hours apparently
[39:21] um different Scud missiles have been
[39:23] firing and landing near them. So a very
[39:26] close call but fortunately he does have
[39:28] good news to report. No members of the
[39:30] 159th Brigade injured and at this point
[39:32] he's hearing no American casualties.
[39:35] We're going to go now back to network
[39:36] coverage
[39:37] >> hearing about ground action if anything.
[39:39] We're not hearing from our reporters who
[39:41] are embedded so we presume they're on
[39:43] the move. Jim
[39:44] >> uh they could be although it was thought
[39:47] that even there uh that some of the
[39:50] assault on Iraqi ground troops in the
[39:53] south uh would be done in sort of a
[39:55] standoff position. uh that uh that many
[39:58] of these US forces wouldn't quite be
[40:01] rolling into Iraq quite yet. Uh that
[40:04] they'd uh that they'd continue to pound
[40:06] those Iraqi military units uh with
[40:08] artillery uh and perhaps even air
[40:11] strikes. Uh but at this time uh it is
[40:14] unclear to us anyway here at the
[40:16] Pentagon. We're just not getting that
[40:18] kind of detailed vision as to what's
[40:21] going on on the ground in the south. It
[40:23] was thought uh that the air campaign and
[40:27] elements of the ground campaign could
[40:29] begin almost simultaneously. Not
[40:32] necessarily a fullblown invasion across
[40:35] the Iraqi border. Uh but certainly uh
[40:38] even between last night and today uh we
[40:41] understand that there were some ground
[40:42] elements perhaps some special operation
[40:45] forces inside Iraq doing the kinds of
[40:48] things you'd expect them to be doing. uh
[40:50] uh surveilling the military, surveying
[40:52] air strips and and possible routes for
[40:55] US troops to take uh once they do get in
[40:57] on the ground. Uh but it's not clear yet
[40:59] from here uh that a major ground
[41:02] invasion uh has be has begun or will
[41:05] begin soon. Tom.
[41:06] >> All right, thanks very much NBC Jim
[41:08] Mcccleesky at the Pentagon. It's also
[41:10] worth pointing out that homeland
[41:11] security is a major concern now that the
[41:13] war is underway. Connecticut, New
[41:15] Jersey, and New York today uh formed a
[41:17] combine as it were, a national guard,
[41:20] state highway patrolman, and local
[41:22] police to guard uh targets of
[41:24] opportunity in u this part of America,
[41:27] bridges, tunnels, that kind of thing. Uh
[41:29] Governor Roland of Connecticut, Governor
[41:31] Pataki of New York, Governor McGrevy of
[41:33] New Jersey holding a joint news
[41:35] conference. Uh there's a place called
[41:37] Sententcom, which is just outside just
[41:39] north and west of Doha in the country of
[41:43] Gat. That's where Tommy Franks, we
[41:45] presume now, is huddled with his senior
[41:47] adviserss uh talking to the people who
[41:49] are running uh the command and control
[41:51] center making the decisions about this
[41:53] war. NBC's Kelly O'Donnell is at Sentcom
[41:56] and she has some information for us.
[41:58] Kelly,
[42:00] >> hello Tom. Yes, Tommy Franks is in his
[42:02] war room which is separate from the
[42:04] joint operations center where he gets
[42:07] all of the information from computers
[42:09] and video conferencing and so forth uh
[42:12] in the field. What I am hearing on this
[42:14] end is similar and may in some ways
[42:16] complement what Jim Mikvsky is
[42:18] reporting. What I'm being told by
[42:19] multiple sources is that this is not the
[42:22] shock and awe phase of action and that
[42:24] there is in fact a simultaneous ground
[42:26] attack and air assault. As Jim pointed
[42:29] out, it may not be full scale, but yes,
[42:31] in fact, there are ground forces and air
[42:34] forces on the move at the same time. It
[42:36] was also pointed out to me today to look
[42:38] carefully at what uh Secretary Rumsfeld
[42:40] said in his briefing today and he said
[42:42] this. This is pretty close to a quote
[42:45] that the force scope and scale of that
[42:48] has never been seen before in referring
[42:50] to the kind of assault. They are telling
[42:53] me that it will be unmistakable and the
[42:55] kinds of images that are coming in from
[42:56] Baghdad tonight do not meet that
[42:58] threshold. So that's some of the
[43:00] information that we're getting at this
[43:02] point. General Tommy Franks has been
[43:04] working throughout the evening and uh it
[43:06] is of course nighttime here now and we
[43:08] are getting some sense that uh there
[43:10] will be no briefing from this location
[43:13] perhaps not even tomorrow. We were also
[43:15] told that this level of activity could
[43:18] go on 24 48 hours unclear and that in
[43:21] his communication with the White House
[43:23] that uh the administration understands
[43:25] that when the military was given the
[43:27] go-ahead to execute this in their own
[43:29] way of determining what was best from a
[43:31] military strategy that it may take this
[43:33] kind of time. We've also been told that
[43:36] the strategic surprise was so important
[43:38] to General Tommy Franks and when there
[43:40] was so much discussion of shock in all
[43:42] this different kind of approach may in
[43:44] fact play into that. Tom.
[43:47] >> All right. Thanks very much NBC's Kelly
[43:50] O'Donnell. One of the major
[43:52] considerations of course well what
[43:53] they're going to do with the the
[43:55] refugees uh what they're going to do
[43:56] with the humanitarian efforts which are
[43:59] going to be considerable. There are
[44:00] about a million children in Iraq who are
[44:02] malnourished on a day daily basis. U the
[44:05] United Nations is responsible for
[44:07] feeding about 13 million people a day
[44:09] under the so-called oil for food program
[44:12] in which Saddam Hussein can export some
[44:14] oil. He gets in return food that's
[44:17] distributed to the population. There's
[44:19] an enormous black market that goes on
[44:21] there. But the impression strongly is
[44:23] that the proceeds from that black market
[44:26] goes primarily to the leadership of
[44:27] Saddam Hussein and his family.
[44:30] Otherwise, how could they support those
[44:31] grand palaces, those luxurious places?
[44:33] David,
[44:34] >> well, two of his sons are directly tied
[44:36] to the smuggling for oil and Kusay has
[44:38] been involved in cigarettes and
[44:39] everything else smuggling. So, the black
[44:41] market is clearly an official franchise.
[44:44] You don't enter into it unless uh you
[44:46] have someone in the inner circle as a
[44:48] partner. So yeah, that's that's there. I
[44:51] I really do worry about the both the
[44:54] refugee and the immediate relief issue.
[44:56] You've got a population that's lived
[44:58] under considerable stress for more than
[45:00] a decade. Uh they're going to demand and
[45:03] need medical care and food immediately.
[45:07] And this is known by the uh the forces
[45:09] moving in and it's going to be a
[45:11] considerable drain on resources as they
[45:12] move ahead. particularly if this turns
[45:14] out to be longer than most of us expect
[45:16] it to be and more violent in urban areas
[45:18] than we hope it to be.
[45:19] >> All right, let's go to General Monty
[45:21] Migs now who's over at the teleustrator
[45:23] who's going to tell us about the shape
[45:24] of the battlefield but also this whole
[45:26] issue about United States ground forces
[45:29] having to become policemen once they get
[45:31] to Baghdad. They're English-speaking
[45:33] Christians in a heavily Muslim country
[45:35] speaking Arabic.
[45:37] >> This is a real problem. I'll talk about
[45:38] that. We'll zoom in here and take a look
[45:39] at Iraq and get a sense of the ground
[45:41] and then we'll talk about this very,
[45:43] very important transition from combat
[45:45] operations to peacekeeping. I put this
[45:47] map up because it's important that
[45:49] people understand the synergy between
[45:51] air and ground and the fact that we have
[45:53] these two no-fly zones here that the Air
[45:56] Force pretty much owns and has owned for
[45:59] a long period of time. So, as a ground
[46:01] commander with my soldiers, if my or
[46:04] they were my soldiers and they were
[46:05] under fire like they were today, I'd
[46:06] want to get him out of those foxholes
[46:08] just as quick as I could. And so, this
[46:11] area that we're looking at here
[46:14] may well be very easy to traverse and
[46:18] get in very, very quickly. And remember,
[46:20] we've talked along about the necessity
[46:22] to get across the rivers in a way that
[46:24] the enemy didn't anticipate and gets
[46:26] ahead of his decision cycle. And so what
[46:30] we're going to see, I suspect, is some
[46:32] very quick
[46:35] avenues, attacks up into areas that are
[46:37] strategically important. One of them
[46:40] obviously being the western desert.
[46:43] Another one, of course, the area around
[46:47] Baghdad
[46:49] and Tree.
[46:50] the quicker you can get there and
[46:52] surprise the enemy with the fact that
[46:54] you're already in his backyard adds to
[46:56] the shock and awe effect. Now, one of
[47:00] the very very important things that uh
[47:02] General Wallace, General Abisade, and
[47:03] General Francis are going to be worrying
[47:05] about is as the forces are coming up,
[47:08] you have to separate the factions.
[47:10] You've got to make sure that the that
[47:12] the revenge killings and that kind of
[47:14] score settling doesn't take over. You've
[47:17] also got to make sure that as these
[47:19] sites pop up that are suspected to have
[47:22] weapons of mass destruction in them or
[47:24] perhaps uh nuclear materials, you've
[47:26] immediately got to flex troops out,
[47:28] assess it, and secure it. And at the
[47:31] same time, when you get into the builtup
[47:33] areas after you've had this fighting in
[47:34] the complex terrain, you have to do
[47:36] something we didn't do in Bosnia that we
[47:38] didn't understand. Tom, that goes to
[47:40] your initial point about
[47:42] our type of folks coming in into a
[47:45] completely different country, completely
[47:46] different neighborhood. In these
[47:48] countries, the black market is
[47:51] associated in by the secret security
[47:54] services and it's a very important part
[47:57] of the control of the country. If the
[47:59] peacekeeping effort fails, as was done
[48:02] in the last administration, to attack
[48:04] that as part of establishing good
[48:06] governance, this can be very, very
[48:08] difficult. In fact, some of those
[48:10] remnants remain in Bosnia today. And we
[48:12] just saw the prime minister in Serbia
[48:14] was assassinated most likely by
[48:16] representatives of this of this same
[48:17] type of connectivity that exists in
[48:19] Serbia still today. And um Monty, once
[48:22] they get to Baghdad, uh will they be
[48:25] bringing in MP kinds of forces, uh
[48:29] reserveists who are trained specifically
[48:31] to do that, or are they going to have to
[48:32] put the combat people into those jobs?
[48:34] >> With the amount, it's hard to know right
[48:36] now, but with the amount of troops we
[48:37] see on the ground at this point, the MP
[48:39] brigades are certainly going to be
[48:40] involved in that because they do have
[48:42] this uh law enforcement capability and
[48:44] they're trained for it. civil affairs is
[48:46] going to be there and I'm sure you'll
[48:47] see a lot of National Guard and Reserve
[48:49] civil affairs and they will they will
[48:51] change the task organization to allow
[48:53] the combat soldiers to address this kind
[48:55] of problem. But one of the things we
[48:57] learned in Bosnia when you have some bad
[48:59] actors the way you face them down is you
[49:01] confront them with overwhelming force
[49:03] and they back off you don't have a
[49:04] firefight. All right, thanks very much.
[49:06] General Monty Migs, uh, a Navy veteran
[49:09] who is now the chairman of the Senate
[49:10] Armed Services Committee, a longtime
[49:12] Republican power in the United States
[49:14] Senate, joins us now. Senator John
[49:16] Warner of Virginia, who was out in that
[49:18] region not so long ago assessing
[49:20] American preparation and force
[49:22] readiness. Uh, General Warner, what's
[49:24] your assessment of what we have heard
[49:25] from administration officials so far and
[49:27] what you're seeing on your television
[49:28] screen? First, Tom, it's Petty Off Petty
[49:31] Officer Third Class Warner, World War II
[49:34] veteran, uh, a a people you wrote about
[49:38] so brilliantly. And let me tell you,
[49:40] these troops today are every bit as good
[49:44] as anyone that ever served in uniform in
[49:46] the United States, even a little bit
[49:48] better in my judgment. So, we're here in
[49:52] the Congress going about our business,
[49:54] but right now I'm leaving to go to the
[49:56] floor to work with the majority leader
[50:00] and indeed the Democratic leader in
[50:03] managing the debate on an important
[50:05] resolution where the Congress recites
[50:08] its steadfast support for the
[50:10] commander-in-chief, our president, the
[50:13] men and women of the armed forces, their
[50:15] families, and I might add, a number of
[50:17] civilians, most in federal federal
[50:19] service who are in harm's way taking the
[50:22] risks to in this cause to liberate Iraq.
[50:26] >> Uh Senator, we did have Senator Dashel
[50:28] on just a few moments ago. He's the
[50:30] Democratic leader who said earlier that
[50:32] he had been disappointed by the failure
[50:33] of the diplomatic effort overnight. He
[50:35] issued a very strong statement in
[50:37] support of the troops. But after his
[50:39] initial speech, there was some very
[50:41] sharp criticism of him of him by
[50:43] Republican party officials in the House
[50:45] of Representatives, even within the
[50:47] administration. Do you think that that
[50:49] kind of acrimonious debate will now go
[50:51] away?
[50:52] >> Uh Tom, it's a matter of history. Uh
[50:55] working this morning with the majority
[50:57] leader Frist, uh we decided in the
[51:00] conduct of this debate that is history.
[51:04] At the moment, I hope all 100 United
[51:07] States senators unite on this
[51:09] resolution. We've worked it in
[51:11] consultation with Senator Dashel and the
[51:14] Democrats, Senator Levan, my counterpart
[51:17] on the Armed Services Committee, and I'm
[51:19] very optimistic that this important
[51:22] statement will reflect unity in the
[51:25] Senate of the United States.
[51:26] >> U, I hesitate to bring it up at a time
[51:28] like this, but there is going to be a
[51:30] dollars and cents issue as well, and I
[51:32] know that that was on the floor of the
[51:33] Senate today. Uh some members of your
[51:36] party as well as a number of Democrats
[51:38] are complaining that they're not hearing
[51:40] enough about the cost estimates from the
[51:42] administration.
[51:42] >> Yes. In meeting with defense officials,
[51:46] uh we anticipate next week the
[51:48] administration will submit a
[51:50] supplemental request uh to cover the
[51:54] operational costs that we foresee. And
[51:56] next week there should be spreading
[51:58] before the American public uh a clear
[52:01] factual case as best we can make the
[52:04] estimates for those costs.
[52:06] >> All right, thanks very much Senator John
[52:07] Warner of Virginia, chairman of the
[52:09] Senate Armed Services Committee, a
[52:11] veteran of World War II, former Navy
[52:13] Secretary. Let's go to the White House
[52:14] now. NBC's David Gregory. David.
[52:17] >> Tom, we'll hear from the president in
[52:19] about 15 minutes. He will be meeting
[52:21] with members of his cabinet and will uh
[52:24] talk to reporters in a pool situation
[52:26] and a limited amount of reporters. White
[52:28] House officials telling us that the
[52:30] purpose of this is to rally the troops.
[52:32] Both the troops within the
[52:34] administration and of course the
[52:35] American public. Officials have been
[52:37] saying that the president would not
[52:39] speak in a sort of minute-by-minute
[52:42] assessment of how the war is going. He
[52:45] wants to frame the issues as he did last
[52:47] night, but he wants to make it clear as
[52:50] he discusses the conduct of the war with
[52:52] his cabinet that there are other areas
[52:55] to focus on, domestic matters, homeland
[52:57] security, and it's a message that he'll
[52:59] emphasize to the public as well. One
[53:02] other point, in the past hour, Tom,
[53:04] officials have been stressing to me that
[53:06] part of what we're seeing in the middle
[53:08] of a lull over Baghdad at the moment is
[53:10] very much part of a theme, a sort of uh
[53:13] punch and stand back, punch and stand
[53:16] back, surgical strikes. You heard Ari
[53:18] Fleer in his briefing say something that
[53:20] was very important and something that
[53:22] officials are stressing and that is that
[53:23] they would still accept Saddam Hussein
[53:26] to go into exile. You heard a similar
[53:29] point from Secretary of Defense
[53:31] Rumsfeld. They want to use enough
[53:33] military force to make the point that
[53:35] Iraq should give up the fight, should
[53:37] totally give up or else the war will get
[53:39] harder and harder on Iraq. Tom.
[53:42] >> All right. Thanks very much. Uh NBC's
[53:43] David Gregory as he reported. We will be
[53:46] hearing from the president before too
[53:48] long in what is a pool arrangement that
[53:51] is several representatives of the very
[53:54] large White House press corp will go
[53:55] into the Oval Office with cameras
[53:56] rolling. the president will have
[53:58] something to say at that time. Whether
[53:59] he'll take questions, we still don't
[54:01] know. He does have a cabinet meeting uh
[54:03] scheduled for 2:30 today. He was
[54:05] awakened at 6:00 this morning by Kandi
[54:08] Rice, his national security adviser, uh
[54:10] to give him an update on what happened
[54:12] overnight. Uh they are still trying to
[54:15] assess whether or not they got Saddam
[54:16] Hussein. uh the evidence at least to
[54:19] those people who are looking in does
[54:21] appear that they did not. But he does
[54:24] have body doubles and in fact the CIA is
[54:27] continuing to try to get a recording of
[54:30] his voice from earlier and then match it
[54:32] against the recording from last night.
[54:34] Uh we're going to have continuing
[54:36] coverage here. I want to remind you that
[54:38] it is now coming up on 10:00 at night in
[54:41] Baghdad. Uh about an hour ago, there was
[54:44] a lot of activity in the skies over
[54:46] Baghdad and obviously American uh era
[54:49] attacks were successful on several key
[54:51] buildings. Information installations,
[54:54] security leadership positions, the
[54:56] former office of Tariq Ziz, and now
[54:59] there is a pause. Um this is obviously a
[55:02] new kind of air campaign as General
[55:04] Monty Migs has been quick to point out
[55:07] and to emphasize that it's not just a
[55:09] fireworks show. It's designed to
[55:11] paralyze the leadership to strike right
[55:14] at the nervous system at the very top of
[55:16] the Iraqi leadership uh to give a pause
[55:19] and then to come back again with another
[55:21] wave of attacks that probably will be
[55:23] surgical the second time around as well.
[55:25] General Short, would you agree with
[55:26] that?
[55:27] >> Tom, I do. And I think it's important to
[55:28] understand that in that pause, we're
[55:30] trying to assess. We we don't want to go
[55:33] out and just blow things up as you
[55:34] pointed out. We'd like to know how we
[55:36] did in the first wave. Do we need to
[55:38] reattack or can we move to a second set
[55:40] of targets? So, we're looking to get
[55:42] information from our overhead
[55:43] satellites. Uh pro probably from
[55:45] predator or global hog vehicles and from
[55:48] the pilots themselves. Uh I've never met
[55:50] a fighter pilot didn't think he hit his
[55:51] target, but we're asking for an honest
[55:53] assessment. Do you think you got it or
[55:54] not? Do we need to reattack or not?
[55:56] >> Okay. Well, we want to tell you now that
[55:59] it's 2:00 uh in the eastern United
[56:01] States. It is 1000 p.m. in Baghdad and
[56:05] the people there are waiting for what
[56:07] they are sure to realize is more to
[56:09] come. They've been through two wars
[56:11] before. Uh a long costly war with Iraq,
[56:14] the invasion of Kuwait, Operation Desert
[56:16] Storm, and now a war that's coming right
[56:18] to their doorsteps. It is night time in
[56:19] Baghdad. The first stage of the air and
[56:21] ground war of Operation Iraqi Freedom is
[56:24] underway officially. This is the view
[56:26] from Baghdad with the skies lit up, the
[56:29] flash of explosions. Three separate
[56:31] sites in that city appear to be burning.
[56:33] The bombing is expected to continue for
[56:35] several hours. Combat is intensifying as
[56:38] well along the Iraqi Kuwaiti border. The
[56:41] US Third Infantry Division has unleashed
[56:43] a barrage of artillery fire on Iraqi
[56:46] troops. There are reports of as many as
[56:49] four oil fires burning in southern Iraq.
[56:52] Presumably, they were set deliberately.
[56:54] There's also the intriguing question of
[56:55] whether it was indeed Saddam or a
[56:57] stand-in who appeared on Iraqi
[56:59] television just a few hours after
[57:01] yesterday's missile strike on a senior
[57:03] leadership bunker in Baghdad. Was Saddam
[57:06] killed or wounded? What about his sons U
[57:08] and Kusay? That along with tape still is
[57:12] being analyzed at this hour. It's also
[57:14] worth pointing out that Secretary of
[57:16] State uh Secretary of Defense Donald
[57:18] Rumsfeld at about 11:15 this morning
[57:20] came out to say that the war is underway
[57:23] and then made a very strong statement to
[57:27] Iraqi military leaders and to the Iraqi