NewsNight (CNN) - 2005-10-28
Channel: malgent
Transcript
Language: English (original, YouTube automatic captions)
[0:00] new book. Speaking of extraordinary, I
[0:03] had lunch with an extraordinary
[0:04] gentleman today. He's hosting News Night
[0:06] tonight solo. Anderson Cooper is off
[0:08] again. He's Aaron Brown, the man of
[0:11] renown. Have a great weekend. You're off
[0:13] next week. Have a great week off. Have a
[0:15] good time. And you know,
[0:16] >> thank you. Coming under par.
[0:19] >> Thank you. I I hope I am. I expect it'll
[0:21] be an interesting week. Thank you very
[0:22] much. Good evening again, everyone. It
[0:24] began with 16 words uttered by the
[0:26] president about Iraq and nuclear
[0:28] weapons. Only 16 words in a very long
[0:31] speech. It became a battle and a scandal
[0:34] and now perhaps a crime.
[0:39] Vice President Cheny's chief of staff is
[0:41] indicted after two years of secretive
[0:43] digging. The special prosecutor sends
[0:45] shock waves through the Bush White
[0:46] House.
[0:47] >> Special counsel Fitzgerald's
[0:48] investigation
[0:50] and ongoing legal proceedings are
[0:52] serious.
[0:53] >> Suzan Malvo tonight on just how serious.
[0:57] Lewis Scooter Libby described as second
[0:59] only to Carl Rove in the White House
[1:01] inner circle resigned immediately and
[1:03] could face 30 years in prison. Gary
[1:05] Tuckman gets more on the man behind the
[1:07] controversy.
[1:09] President Bush's deputy chief of staff
[1:10] Carl Rove is off the hook. Or is he?
[1:13] >> I will not end the investigation until I
[1:16] can look uh anyone in the eye and tell
[1:18] them that we have carried out our
[1:20] responsibility um sufficiently.
[1:23] >> John King looks at the future of the
[1:24] president's top adviser.
[1:27] And if Libby lied, there's this
[1:29] question. Why? David Ensor on the
[1:31] indictments and how the US justified war
[1:34] with Saddam. This is News Night with
[1:37] Anderson Cooper and Aaron Brown. Live
[1:39] from the CNN broadcast center in New
[1:42] York. Here's Aaron Brown.
[1:44] Good evening. Again, as Larry said,
[1:46] Anderson's off tonight. The story of how
[1:48] we got from uranium in Africa to a
[1:51] reporter in jail to a White House under
[1:53] siege is only half written tonight at
[1:56] best. There are many more chapters to
[1:58] come, many questions to be answered, not
[2:00] the least of which is why, if true, did
[2:03] a smart and incredibly savvy White House
[2:06] insider lie so obviously to
[2:09] investigators and did he do it if he did
[2:11] it to protect his boss, the vice
[2:13] president? There is that and more. But
[2:16] also there is also this the plain and
[2:19] powerful words of a federal prosecutor
[2:20] with a reputation for playing it
[2:23] straight. Laws were broken. He said not
[2:25] technicalities but laws. A full night on
[2:29] this tonight. A full house. CNN's Suzan
[2:32] Malvo at the White House. John King in
[2:35] Washington. David Ensor as well. And we
[2:38] begin with Ms. Malvo. Suzan,
[2:41] >> the cloud that has been hanging over the
[2:42] Bush administration for nearly 2 years
[2:45] from the CIA leak investigation finally
[2:47] broke. Scooter Libby was a trusted
[2:50] member of Mr. Bush's most inner circle.
[2:52] But the fivecount indictment of Vice
[2:54] President Cheny's chief of staff is not
[2:56] the end of the probe.
[2:58] >> I'm going to have a great and a
[3:00] fantastic weekend. Hope you do. Carl
[3:02] Rove, the president's top political
[3:04] adviser, escaped indictment today, but
[3:07] his lawyer, says he remains under
[3:08] investigation.
[3:09] >> I will not end the investigation until I
[3:12] can look uh anyone in the eye and tell
[3:14] them that we have carried out our
[3:16] responsibility um sufficiently.
[3:19] >> A belleaguered Mr. Bush departing for
[3:21] his Camp David retreat tried to soften
[3:23] the blow.
[3:24] >> While we're all saddened by today's
[3:26] news, we remain wholly focused on the
[3:28] many issues and opportunities facing
[3:29] this country.
[3:31] I got a job to do and so do the people
[3:33] who work in the White House.
[3:34] >> White House insiders say they are
[3:36] saddened by Libbyy's departure, but are
[3:38] relieved that Rogue seemed to have been
[3:40] spared. Cheney, who stuck to his
[3:42] schedule of fundraising and rallying
[3:44] Georgia troops, said in a written
[3:46] statement, "He accepted his top
[3:47] lieutenant's resignation with deep
[3:49] regret. Scooter Libby is one of the most
[3:52] capable and talented individuals I have
[3:54] ever known. He has given many years of
[3:56] his life to public service and has
[3:58] served our nation tirelessly and with
[4:00] great distinction. In a statement of his
[4:02] own, Libby said, "I am confident that at
[4:04] the end of this process, I will be
[4:06] completely and totally exonerated.
[4:09] >> I look forward to working with Congress
[4:10] on policies to keep this economy
[4:12] moving."
[4:12] >> For President Bush, the strategy is to
[4:14] pivot towards his political agenda. The
[4:17] question now is, can this White House
[4:19] get that famous first-term focus back?
[4:22] That is the real challenge. Certainly he
[4:24] needs some some fresh blood. He needs to
[4:28] focus on big bold things.
[4:31] >> And Aaron, of course, one of those big
[4:32] things that he is talking about is
[4:34] picking his Supreme Court nominee. We
[4:36] are told by White House aids that could
[4:38] happen within days. Interesting enough,
[4:40] too, the strategy of the White House. We
[4:42] saw two memos that went out to White
[4:44] House staffers uh late in the day. One
[4:47] from a chief of staff Andy Card saying,
[4:49] "Look, your job first and foremost is to
[4:51] serve the American people." The second
[4:53] one from White House counsel which
[4:55] simply said that they should not reach
[4:57] out to Scooter Libby to discuss this
[4:59] case in any way that it is still an
[5:00] ongoing investigation. Aaron
[5:02] >> Suzanne, thank you very much. Suzan
[5:04] Malvo at the White House. This all began
[5:07] as I'm sure you know by now with
[5:08] Ambassador Joe Wilson's trip to Nger
[5:11] back in February of 2002. He had nothing
[5:14] to say on camera when reached at his
[5:16] home today. He did release a statement
[5:18] through his lawyer. It is certainly not
[5:20] a day to celebrate, the statement reads.
[5:23] It goes on to say, "When an indictment
[5:25] is delivered at the front door of the
[5:26] White House, the office of the president
[5:28] is defiled. No citizen can take pleasure
[5:32] from that." Almost from the beginning,
[5:34] this story has been a story and a puzzle
[5:36] with three dimensions: policy and
[5:39] politics, and of course, the law. Before
[5:41] we get any further into all three, here
[5:43] are the charges facing Mr. Libby
[5:45] tonight. Five of them all felonies.
[5:48] Count one, obstruction of justice. It
[5:51] alleges Mr. Libby intentionally deceived
[5:53] the FBI and the grand jury about how he
[5:56] discovered Valerie Plame's status as a
[5:59] covert CIA officer. Count two, false
[6:02] statement, lying to the FBI about
[6:04] whether Miss Pla's status was well
[6:06] known, saying falsely. The indictment
[6:08] alleges that NBC's Tim Russer told him
[6:12] that reporters were well aware of her
[6:14] identity. Count three, false statement,
[6:17] lying to the FBI about the content of a
[6:20] conversation or conversations with Time
[6:23] magazine's Matthew Cooper. Counts four
[6:25] and five relate to the last two, but are
[6:28] classified as perjury instead of simply
[6:31] making false statements because the
[6:33] statements in question were made under
[6:35] oath to a federal grand jury. If
[6:37] convicted of all five counts, Mr. Libby
[6:40] could receive as much as 30 years in
[6:43] prison. How much of this is intended to
[6:46] loosen up his tongue, we simply do not
[6:48] know. Only the prosecutor does, and he's
[6:50] not saying. Patrick Fitzgerald met with
[6:52] the press this afternoon after two years
[6:54] of virtual silence. The questions must
[6:57] have seemed like opening a trip valve on
[6:59] Hoover Dam. As for his answers, he said
[7:02] very little about the inner workings of
[7:04] the investigation. Instead, what made
[7:06] the moment so remarkable was how plainly
[7:10] and how passionately he stated the case.
[7:15] In trying to explain how the disclosure
[7:17] of a CIA agent's name evolved into an
[7:20] investigation that ins snared one of
[7:22] Washington's most powerful men, Patrick
[7:25] Fitzgerald put it in terms he felt most
[7:28] comfortable using, the language of
[7:31] baseball. What would the punishment be?
[7:33] He asked if a pitcher intentionally
[7:37] threw at the head of a batter. And then
[7:39] you'd make a decision as to whether this
[7:40] person should be banned from baseball,
[7:42] whether he should be suspended, whether
[7:44] you should do nothing at all and just
[7:45] say, "Hey, the person threw a bad pitch.
[7:47] Get over it." In this case, it's a lot
[7:49] more serious than baseball. And the
[7:51] damage wasn't to one person. It wasn't
[7:53] to Valerie Wilson. It was done to all of
[7:54] us.
[7:55] >> What he decided, he said, was this.
[7:58] >> This is a very serious matter, and
[8:00] compromising national security
[8:01] information is a very serious matter.
[8:03] But the need to get to the bottom of
[8:05] what happened and whether national
[8:08] security was compromised by
[8:09] inadvertence, by recklessness, by
[8:11] maliciousness is extremely important.
[8:14] >> And this is why.
[8:16] >> And we need to know the truth. And
[8:18] anyone who would go into a grand jury
[8:20] and lie, obstruct, and impede the
[8:22] investigation has committed a serious
[8:24] crime. But if what we allege in the
[8:26] indictment is true, then what is charged
[8:29] is a very, very serious crime that will
[8:31] vindicate the public interest in finding
[8:32] out what happened here. And about
[8:34] forcing Judith Miller of the New York
[8:36] Times to jail,
[8:38] >> no one wanted to have a dispute uh with
[8:41] the New York Times or anyone else. I
[8:43] would have wished nothing better that
[8:45] when the subpoenas were issued in August
[8:46] 2004, witnesses testified then and we
[8:50] would have been here in in October 2004
[8:52] instead of October 2005. No one would
[8:55] have went to jail. I didn't have a
[8:57] vested interest in litigating it. I was
[8:58] not looking for a First Amendment
[9:00] showdown. We didn't bluff people. And
[9:02] what we decided to do was to make sure
[9:03] before we subpoenaed any reporter that
[9:05] we really needed that testimony.
[9:07] >> Testimony he said today that was vital
[9:10] to his case. At the end of the day, what
[9:13] appears is that Mr. Libbyy's story that
[9:15] he was at the tail end of a chain of
[9:17] phone calls, passing on from one
[9:19] reporter what he heard from another was
[9:21] not true. It was false. He was at the
[9:24] beginning of the chain of the phone
[9:25] calls, the first official to disclose
[9:28] this information outside the government
[9:30] to a reporter and that he lied about it
[9:32] afterwards under oath and repeatedly.
[9:36] >> The allegations if Mr. Fitzgerald has
[9:38] said little until now. The political
[9:40] establishment tonight is saying even
[9:43] less. Democratic lawmakers by and large
[9:45] are staying away from the microphones by
[9:47] and large. So did a lot of Republicans.
[9:50] We did manage to get some reaction from
[9:52] Howard Dean who is the chairman of the
[9:54] Democratic Party.
[9:55] >> This is about what happens when you send
[9:57] people to foreign countries to fight
[9:58] without telling America the truth. This
[10:00] whole thing came about because the
[10:02] president wasn't truthful about why we
[10:04] went to Iraq. As for the Republican
[10:06] side, we spoke at some length late this
[10:08] afternoon with John Cenounu, the senator
[10:10] from New Hampshire.
[10:13] Why do you think it people at the vice
[10:18] president's right hand and whether this
[10:20] was criminal or not will be for a jury
[10:22] to decide uh apparently engaged in this
[10:25] effort to u this is my word certainly
[10:28] not yours trash Ambassador Wilson? Well,
[10:32] I think they felt that Ambassador Wilson
[10:34] was a partisan. Uh, and he certainly was
[10:37] politically speaking a partisan. Uh,
[10:40] that he may have had specific motives
[10:43] and goals in mind that were c was
[10:46] certainly counterbalanced by other
[10:48] evidence and other sources of
[10:50] intelligence gathering at the time. Uh,
[10:52] and they felt that there needed to be
[10:54] some sort of a balance out there. That
[10:56] doesn't justify the specific way that
[10:59] they approached it, but I think that was
[11:01] their concern at the time.
[11:03] >> Do you think the vice president, given
[11:05] that an important aid to the vice
[11:08] president, often referred to as this
[11:09] right-hand man, a national security
[11:11] adviser, uh that the vice president
[11:13] needs to answer some questions here? I I
[11:16] don't have access to the material that
[11:17] was presented to the grand jury and and
[11:20] I think uh the defense teams and the
[11:23] prosecution are perfectly capable of
[11:25] deciding who needs to provide
[11:27] information in order to um uh fairly try
[11:31] the case.
[11:31] >> Uh respectfully, uh that's a very narrow
[11:34] legal answer to something whether he
[11:36] needs to testify. And actually uh if I
[11:39] may try the question again, I'm really
[11:41] interested in whether you believe there
[11:43] are questions the vice president needs
[11:45] to answer.
[11:46] >> I think you need to be specific. What
[11:48] kind of a what kind of a question? I
[11:49] think everyone knows what Vice President
[11:51] Cheny's position was on on intelligence
[11:55] on prosecuting the war. Uh certainly
[11:58] people understand and know his
[11:59] relationship to Scooter Libby who served
[12:01] him very well, very capably. So, like if
[12:04] there's a a specific question that you
[12:06] want to pose to the vice president that
[12:08] the media wants to pose to him, yes, you
[12:11] you should ask those questions.
[12:12] >> Well, let me try one then. Sure. Um um
[12:15] would you like to know if the vice
[12:17] president was in any way involved in
[12:20] discussions that led to the outing of
[12:24] Ms. Pla? I think that question's been
[12:27] largely answered uh in the release of
[12:30] the notes of the conversation that he
[12:32] and Scooter Libby had that the
[12:35] apparently by uh what's been reported
[12:38] and what's been presented in the way of
[12:40] information from the grand jury. I guess
[12:42] this was one of the the leaks prior to
[12:44] the indictment. There was a conversation
[12:47] uh between the two of them that did
[12:48] involve um the fact that Joe Wilson's
[12:52] wife was an employee at the CIA. My
[12:54] question was, was he involved in a
[12:56] decision to out her? Was he in any way
[13:00] involved in discussions? Did he say,
[13:02] "Yes, Scooter, that's a heck of an
[13:04] idea." Or, "Don't you dare do that." Or,
[13:06] "What are you thinking? Don't you want
[13:08] to know that?"
[13:10] >> Um, I think that's less important than
[13:13] whether the laws involving the
[13:16] disclosure were violated. And I think
[13:18] this the prosecutor has pursued that
[13:21] question uh fairly effectively. and of
[13:24] course whether people have been
[13:25] forthcoming on the questions of perjury
[13:28] and cooperating with investigators and
[13:30] on that issue he's been very clear that
[13:33] uh he believes the law was violated and
[13:36] that's why he's handed down the
[13:37] indictments.
[13:38] >> Republican Senator John Cenoun, you'd
[13:40] have a hard time knowing it. There is
[13:42] other news to report tonight and we have
[13:44] more on the indictments coming up, but
[13:46] here are some of the other stories we're
[13:47] following at this moment. 45 police
[13:49] officers in New Orleans were fired
[13:51] today. They were let go for allegedly
[13:54] abandoning their post either before or
[13:56] after Katrina hit. 15 other officers
[13:59] have resigned. In California, the mother
[14:02] of a teen accused of killing the wife of
[14:04] a prominent defense attorney has been
[14:06] released from jail. Esther Fielding was
[14:09] charged as an accessory to murder after
[14:11] the fact, but today police decided to
[14:14] drop the charges. Her son, who is 16,
[14:16] will be tried as an adult. Today, the
[14:18] United Nations Security Council
[14:20] condemned recent comments by Iran's
[14:22] president that Israel should be wiped
[14:25] off the map. The Israeli government says
[14:27] Iran's membership in the UN should be
[14:29] revoked because of the harsh words. And
[14:31] a fitting remembrance for Rosa Parks,
[14:34] the mother of the civil rights movement,
[14:35] who died earlier in the week, will lie
[14:38] in honor Sunday and Monday in the
[14:41] capital rotunda of the United States of
[14:43] America. Congress has authorized that
[14:45] right only 29 times in our country's
[14:48] history and Miss Parks is the first
[14:50] woman to ever receive the tribute.
[14:54] Back to the Libby indictment next. This
[14:56] is a story, as we said at the top, with
[14:58] many dimensions and complic
[15:00] complications. It is still by and large
[15:02] a mystery. Ahead tonight, we look more
[15:04] closely at the parts and the pieces and
[15:06] how they fit. And more on Scooter Libby
[15:09] himself, closer to the vice president
[15:11] perhaps than anyone but the president
[15:13] himself. And a closer look at where the
[15:15] case may go from here. We'll talk with
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[18:19] If there's a leak out of my
[18:20] administration, I want to know who it
[18:22] is.
[18:24] Uh, and
[18:26] if the person has violated law, that
[18:28] person will be taken care of.
[18:32] Innocent until proven guilty is a sacred
[18:34] American ideal. But if America's first
[18:37] impression of you comes from the mouth
[18:39] of a special prosecutor, you're pro
[18:41] probably already behind in the battle
[18:43] for public opinion. It may have been
[18:45] some comfort for Scooter Libby to hear
[18:47] the president and the vice president
[18:50] praise him for the work he's done for
[18:52] his country, but the stakes for him are
[18:54] now enormous. He could face up to 30
[18:56] years in prison. So, who is Scooter
[18:59] Libby? Here's CNN's Gary Tuckman.
[19:03] >> Just as George W. Bush relies on Dick
[19:06] Cheney. Dick Cheney has relied on
[19:08] Scooter Libby.
[19:09] >> Scooter Libby, in my view, is the second
[19:12] most powerful uh staff member in the
[19:15] White House, second only to Carl Row.
[19:19] You may not have heard of Libby until
[19:20] the midst of this scandal, but he's been
[19:22] at the center of power in the Bush White
[19:24] House. Libby, who's on crutches because
[19:26] of an injured foot, was educated at Yale
[19:28] and has been in and out of government
[19:30] for decades. He's a lawyer and
[19:32] ironically considering what he's going
[19:34] through was quite skilled at getting
[19:36] people out of legal trouble. Libby and
[19:38] the vice president got acquainted with
[19:39] Cheney was the defense secretary under
[19:41] the first President Bush. By 2000, Libby
[19:44] was one of Cheny's top adviserss and
[19:46] followed him to the White House. Libby
[19:48] was with Cheney on September 11th, 2001
[19:51] and in the days after when the vice
[19:53] president was moved into secure
[19:55] locations in response to the 9/11
[19:57] terrorist attacks. Libby has a
[19:59] wellestablished reputation as an
[20:01] administration hawk.
[20:02] >> Scooter Libby is a formidable uh figure
[20:06] in this administration who's been
[20:08] involved in virtually every critical
[20:13] national security uh decision, including
[20:17] uh the war in Iraq.
[20:20] >> Libby prepared a document that argued
[20:22] the case for going to war against Iraq.
[20:24] a document that reportedly became the
[20:26] basis for Secretary of State Coen
[20:27] Powell's presentation to the United
[20:29] Nations. But there's a very different
[20:31] side to Libby. He authored a novel
[20:33] called The Apprentice, a story of
[20:35] romance and intrigue set in 1903 Japan.
[20:38] It was a book that won praise from
[20:39] literary critics. Libby told a New York
[20:42] Times interviewer when the paperback
[20:43] came out that he occasionally dreams,
[20:45] quote, of just becoming a novelist and
[20:47] sitting on Cree and drinking oddnamed
[20:50] wines. He's got a lot more on his mind
[20:53] now. Gary Tuckman, CNN New York.
[20:57] >> Coming up tonight, a look at the man who
[20:59] was not indicted today. Kyle Rove. Was
[21:02] it just a temporary reprieve or is he
[21:04] off the hook? Also, this is going to
[21:07] sting a little. We'll tell you about
[21:08] some flu shots that weren't. We'll also
[21:12] take a break first from New York. This
[21:15] is News Night.
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[22:21] >> Hi, Smith from archives. Uh, we've got a
[22:24] little problem that I think you as the
[22:25] head of HR need to know about. It's
[22:27] called Johnson and it needs to go
[22:28] bye-bye. This gentleman refuses to
[22:30] leave.
[22:33] He's a troublemaker that needs to be.
[22:40] Kellogg's Toasted Honey Crunch. So
[22:41] crunchy. So honey, so clustery, so good.
[22:45] >> You're in on it, aren't you?
[22:47] >> Kellogg's Toasted Honey Crunch sounds
[22:49] good.
[22:55] >> Hey, isn't Jacobson choking?
[22:58] >> I'd definitely say Jacobson's choking.
[23:00] >> I know exactly what to do. I've seen in
[23:02] the movies. It's called the Heimck
[23:03] maneuver. You make a ball, stand behind
[23:05] the guy, and pull hard. The action on
[23:07] the solar plexus. Let's try the solar
[23:09] plexus.
[23:09] >> Expels the clue.
[23:14] Just like I told you.
[23:15] >> Let's talk.
[23:16] >> Just like in the movie.
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[23:35] >> Katrina. We were there when it hit. When
[23:38] it was over, we asked the tough
[23:40] questions and demanded answers. We're
[23:43] there now and we'll stay as the golf
[23:45] states rebuild. It's what you expect.
[23:47] It's why we're here. CNN,
[24:04] >> turn off the ambulite function on your
[24:06] Philips Flat TV.
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[24:26] Quick look down at some of the other
[24:27] stories making news tonight. We go to
[24:29] Atlanta and Erica Hill. Good evening
[24:30] again, Ms. Hill.
[24:32] >> Good evening to you, Aaron. this Friday.
[24:34] Unfortunately, I have to tell you about
[24:35] another storm, tropical storm Beta,
[24:37] causing concern in the western Caribbean
[24:39] tonight. It plowed into the tiny
[24:40] Caribbean island of Providencia today
[24:42] and has its sights set on Nicaragua.
[24:45] Forecasters say the storm could build
[24:47] hurricane strength at any moment. Now, a
[24:50] hurricane warning is in effect for the
[24:52] east coast of Nicaragua and some coastal
[24:54] residents of v some residents of coastal
[24:56] villages that is are being evacuated.
[24:59] Meanwhile, fake flu shots. The FBI says
[25:02] a thousand Exxon Mobile workers in Texas
[25:05] were injected with fake flu vaccine. The
[25:08] owner of the health company hired to
[25:09] administer the shots has been arrested
[25:10] and officially charged with Medicare
[25:12] fraud. Investigators say he gave similar
[25:14] shots to 14 residents of a Texas senior
[25:17] citizens home the next day. Preliminary
[25:19] tests indicate the syringes were filled
[25:20] with purified water. A nurse who helped
[25:22] give the shots blew the whistle. So far,
[25:25] no ill effects have been reported.
[25:28] And a record number of births to
[25:30] unmarried women, 1 and a half million
[25:32] last year. That's according to a new
[25:34] federal study. More than 80% we should
[25:36] point out 80% of teen mothers are
[25:40] unmarried, but actually the number of
[25:41] teen mothers is falling. The biggest
[25:44] increase came among women in their 20s
[25:45] because many of them are unmarried but
[25:47] living with their partners. So of course
[25:49] still count as unwed mothers. And Second
[25:51] City no more. Thousands turned out in
[25:54] Chicago today to celebrate the White
[25:56] Socks victory in the World Series. This
[25:58] is the team's first World Championship
[26:00] since 1917. So, plenty to celebrate.
[26:02] Many fans say they still can't believe
[26:05] it. Some people in Boston probably still
[26:06] can't believe it from last year. And
[26:08] Aaron, I think I checked the correct
[26:09] paper online, I think.
[26:11] >> Yeah.
[26:12] >> Uh and I believe that the weather today
[26:14] called for a celebration.
[26:15] >> Uh it did indeed. And there there was
[26:17] one. And if you go back and look at the
[26:18] tape from, I don't know, last February
[26:20] or March, you'll see that I actually
[26:21] predicted the White Socks would win the
[26:23] World Series.
[26:24] >> I hope you had some money riding on it,
[26:25] my friend.
[26:26] >> I think I predicted that. I might.
[26:28] >> We'll find the tape.
[26:30] >> Thank you. Have a good weekend, too.
[26:31] Thank you. On we go. The grand jury that
[26:34] indicted Scooter Libby today had nothing
[26:36] to say about Carl Rove. Does that mean
[26:39] the president's top political adviser is
[26:41] off the hook? Our chief national
[26:43] correspondent, John King, reports.
[26:47] The day's first clue came in call Ro's
[26:49] driveway.
[26:50] >> I'm going to have a great Friday and a
[26:52] fantastic weekend. Hope you do.
[26:54] >> The Bush White House is in turmoil, but
[26:56] the president's right-hand man is still
[26:58] on the job, though not out of legal
[27:00] jeopardy.
[27:01] >> We either charge someone or we don't
[27:03] talk about them. And
[27:04] >> the prosecutor won't name names, but
[27:06] Rove remains under investigation. His
[27:08] attorney voicing confidence when the
[27:10] special counsel finishes his work, he
[27:12] will conclude that Mr. Rove has done
[27:14] nothing wrong. That issue is Ro's
[27:16] initial failure to disclose to leak
[27:18] investigators a conversation with
[27:19] reporter Matthew Cooper about CIA
[27:21] operative Valerie Plame. Rove contends
[27:24] it was an inadvertent oversight and that
[27:26] he brought it to the prosecutor's
[27:27] attention as soon as he found an email
[27:29] reminding him. Rove friend and former
[27:32] top White House aid calio says those who
[27:34] don't accept Ro's explanation don't
[27:36] understand the pressure of 18-hour a day
[27:38] White House jobs.
[27:40] >> There are a lot of things that I don't
[27:41] remember. But I go through notes
[27:42] sometimes now and say I don't even
[27:43] remember being in the meeting, let
[27:45] alone, you know, having said what I
[27:47] said.
[27:47] >> Ro has from the beginning insisted he
[27:49] broke no laws.
[27:50] >> Say it.
[27:50] >> I didn't know her name and didn't leak
[27:52] her name.
[27:52] >> What is no longer in dispute, though, is
[27:54] that Rove took part in a hard ball white
[27:56] house political campaign to discredit's
[27:59] husband, Ambassador Joe Wilson, when
[28:01] Wilson accused the White House of hyping
[28:03] the case for war in Iraq.
[28:05] >> I think, you know, hard ball comes with
[28:07] politics. Uh, but hard ball doesn't mean
[28:09] being unfair and it doesn't mean doing
[28:10] anything illegal.
[28:12] >> Some Democrats are more than skeptical
[28:13] and note the investigation isn't over.
[28:16] >> It's going to be interesting over the
[28:18] course of the next few weeks and the
[28:19] next few months to find out exactly what
[28:22] Carl Rove uh did know.
[28:24] >> But for now, Ro is on the job and deeply
[28:27] involved in everything, including the
[28:29] urgent new search for a Supreme Court
[28:31] nominee. Well, Carl, as everybody knows,
[28:33] is uh um an excellent adviser to the
[28:37] president and has interests and a docket
[28:40] that is extremely broad.
[28:42] >> That portfolio in the past few weeks has
[28:44] included managing his own campaign to
[28:46] avoid indictment and quietly
[28:47] orchestrating a strategy to get his
[28:49] version of events out of the grand jury
[28:51] room and into the public domain.
[28:55] Now, Carl Rove is not named in the
[28:56] indictment of Scooter Libby by name, but
[28:58] we do know from two sources familiar
[29:00] with the investigation tonight that Carl
[29:02] Rove is indeed the mysterious official A
[29:05] named in this indictment. Official A,
[29:07] the prosecutor says, is a senior
[29:08] administration official who told Scooter
[29:10] Libby before Bob Novak published the
[29:12] column that started all of this, that
[29:14] Novak was about to write that column.
[29:16] That official A, again, we are told, is
[29:18] indeed Carl Rove. Prosecutors using that
[29:20] to debunk Scooter Libbyy's argument that
[29:22] he first learned about this from
[29:24] reporters. But Aaron, tonight, sources
[29:26] close to Rove insist they just have a
[29:28] few more questions to answer. They
[29:29] believe the prosecutor will shut down
[29:31] this investigation within a matter of
[29:32] weeks with no charges, but the
[29:34] investigation is still ongoing. Rove's
[29:36] closest friends telling him, "Be very
[29:38] careful."
[29:39] Does the fact that we can now say that
[29:41] official A is Carl Rove mean he is in
[29:45] any more legal jeopardy, any less legal
[29:47] jeopardy, or if we just put a little
[29:49] more frosting on a cake? It's a little
[29:52] more frosting on a cake. It's
[29:53] essentially cracking one of the
[29:54] mysteries of the indictment. Prosecutor
[29:56] Fitzgerald said today, "If you can't
[29:58] charge them, we don't name them as in
[29:59] this indictment." So, from the road
[30:01] perspective, they're saying this is
[30:02] proof he did nothing wrong. Others say,
[30:04] "Don't rush to that judgment so quickly.
[30:06] The investigation is still open." John,
[30:08] thank you very much. John King in
[30:10] Washington tonight. Coming up, Back to
[30:11] the Future. From what did the president
[30:13] know to swapping arms for hostages to I
[30:17] did not have sex with that woman, Ms.
[30:19] Lewinsky. thumbnails of scandals of our
[30:22] lives because this is News Night.
[30:40] I didn't know her name and didn't leak
[30:41] her name. Uh the this is at the Justice
[30:44] Department. I'm confident that the uh US
[30:47] attorney, the prosecutor who's involved
[30:48] in looking at this is going to do a very
[30:50] thorough job of of doing a very
[30:53] substantial and conclusive uh
[30:54] investigation.
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[33:14] tomorrow. Fashion icon Karolina Herrera
[33:16] on designing for Jackie O. Jackman
[33:18] shares emotional memories of his 50-year
[33:20] friendship with Tony Randall. Plus,
[33:22] music legend Carlos Santana and more.
[33:24] Larry King Live. CNN tomorrow, 9
[33:27] Eastern. American Morning. What happened
[33:30] overnight and what's happening in the
[33:32] day ahead. Real news makes the
[33:35] difference. Solidad O'Brien and Miles
[33:37] O'Brien. American Morning. CNN Monday
[33:40] morning, 7:00 a.m. Eastern.
[33:48] Think about this for a moment. If you
[33:50] are of a certain age, there is a good
[33:52] chance that once upon a time you were
[33:53] taught to and did trust your government.
[33:56] Indeed, we'd like to think that none of
[33:57] us has become so jaded that we never
[34:00] trust our government. But we have been
[34:02] tested in that regard because sometimes
[34:04] our elected officials lie, cheat, steal,
[34:07] or shall we say kiss inappropriately.
[34:10] Today's scandal is just another in a
[34:12] line.
[34:14] >> A few hours ago, a federal grand jury
[34:17] sitting in the District of Columbia
[34:19] returned a five-count indictment against
[34:21] I Lewis Libby counts.
[34:23] >> Special prosecutor Patrick J. Fitzgerald
[34:25] today saying words no administration
[34:27] wants to hear that one of its own has
[34:30] been indicted. No administration wants
[34:33] to hear it but more than a few have.
[34:36] Some are about sex, others about money,
[34:38] power, or just plain politics. In 1921,
[34:42] it was Teapot Dome, named for a Wyoming
[34:45] town that was home to US oil reserves.
[34:49] Back then, James B. fall. The Secretary
[34:52] of the Interior under President Harding
[34:54] was indicted for accepting bribes from
[34:57] two oil operators. In return, he leased
[35:00] them oil reserves. Oil reserved for the
[35:04] Navy. Fall spent a year in prison, paid
[35:07] a $100,000 fine.
[35:09] >> I'm not a crook.
[35:10] >> Fast forward to 1972.
[35:12] Nixon was president. Watergate the
[35:15] scandal. It started with what the
[35:17] president's press secretary called a
[35:19] third rate burglary. Five men arrested
[35:22] for breaking into the Democratic
[35:23] National Committee headquarters at the
[35:26] Watergate. You know the rest. Washington
[35:29] Post reporters Woodward and Bernsteed
[35:31] kept digging around uncovered a series
[35:33] of crimes and coverups that reached all
[35:36] the way to the White House. In the end,
[35:39] the burglars and two former White House
[35:41] employees eh Howard Hunt and G. Gordon
[35:43] Litty were convicted of conspiracy,
[35:46] burglary, and wiretapping.
[35:49] Three former White House aids were
[35:50] convicted of hindering the
[35:52] investigation. The president himself was
[35:55] named as a co-conspirator.
[35:57] And on August the 9th, 1974,
[36:00] Richard Nixon resigned just ahead of an
[36:04] impeachment trial.
[36:05] >> I told the American people, I did not
[36:08] trade arms for hostages.
[36:09] >> In the mid 80s, there was Iran Contra.
[36:11] The Reagan administration selling arms,
[36:14] anti-tank missiles to be precise, to
[36:16] Iran in hopes of winning the release for
[36:19] Americans held hostage by Iranianbacked
[36:22] terrorists.
[36:25] Money from the sale was used to fund the
[36:27] Sandinista rebels in Nicaragua, and both
[36:30] actions contradicted US policy. There
[36:34] were congressional hearings, indictments
[36:36] against national security adviser John
[36:38] Po Dexter and one of his aids, Colonel
[36:41] Oliver North. Neither ended up in
[36:43] prison.
[36:44] >> I did not have sexual relations with
[36:48] that woman.
[36:49] >> And then the mid90s there was Monica.
[36:52] President Bill Clinton denied an affair
[36:54] with White House intern Monica Lewinsky.
[36:57] Denied it to a national TV audience and
[37:00] unfortunately for him, denied it under
[37:02] oath. He was charged with perjury and
[37:05] obstruction and he was impeached.
[37:08] >> People can debate how big a deal today's
[37:10] indictment is, but consider this. Not
[37:13] since 1875 and President Ulysus Grant
[37:17] has a sitting White House official been
[37:19] indicted. You don't remember Oliver
[37:21] Babcock, of course, but he shares
[37:23] company tonight with Lewis Scooter
[37:26] Libby. So, what's it like to work at a
[37:28] White House in the scandal crisis mode?
[37:30] David Girden has advised both Republican
[37:33] and Democratic presidents, as we seem to
[37:35] say all the time. John Podesta advised
[37:38] Bill Clinton, and Jeff Greenfield often
[37:39] advises me, but that's not why he's here
[37:42] tonight. Uh, gentlemen, let me begin by
[37:45] rolling a piece of tape or having the
[37:46] control room roll one. This is the
[37:48] president this afternoon. Um, kind of
[37:52] look at his face. I'm not sure we've
[37:54] seen him look quite like this or had a
[37:56] day quite like this. Uh, John, what
[38:00] would you guess the president was going
[38:02] through today?
[38:03] >> Today I accepted the resation.
[38:05] >> Well, this was a tough day, Erin, I
[38:07] think, for the president, but he looked
[38:08] like he intended to just tough it out.
[38:10] He didn't look like a guy who intended
[38:12] to change course to clean house. I think
[38:14] he uh looked like uh he was just going
[38:17] to kind of hunker down and try to tough
[38:19] tough tough things out at this point.
[38:21] And David, the importance of looking
[38:23] like you're just you're going to tough
[38:25] it out uh to a president, which they all
[38:27] honestly try and do. They want to get
[38:29] back to the people's business. They
[38:30] always tell us is what?
[38:32] >> Well, let me just say first of all, I
[38:34] knew Oliver Babcock. I worked with
[38:36] Oliver Babcock. The School of Living is
[38:37] no Oliver Babcock.
[38:40] The uh
[38:41] >> Thank you, David.
[38:42] >> Okay. the uh I I think on a day like
[38:46] this with with the importance of the
[38:47] president coming out and toughening it
[38:48] out is exactly what John Podesta said
[38:50] and that is he does not look like he's
[38:53] being very introspective that he's
[38:55] really taking it aboard. In fact, I
[38:56] think there's a certain defiance in this
[38:58] White House. They don't think they've
[39:00] done much wrong. Uh they don't think
[39:02] they made a mistake on Harriet Meers as
[39:03] far as I can tell. They think they she
[39:05] was done in by politics. Uh they don't
[39:07] really think they made much of a mistake
[39:08] here. And so what that suggests is
[39:11] you're not going to see much course
[39:13] correction which I think is quite
[39:14] necessary in fact for them to recover.
[39:16] >> Let me come back to that. But let me
[39:18] draw Jeff in. Um one of the things I've
[39:20] heard a lot today is they've lost
[39:22] control of the agenda. Do you think that
[39:24] the president has lost control of the
[39:26] agenda?
[39:27] >> We're going to find out if he tries to
[39:29] restart his domestic agenda. And I think
[39:31] the one break that they have is that
[39:32] this is an oddnumbered year. Uh, imagine
[39:35] this happening in late October of '04 or
[39:37] next year late October of 06 as people
[39:39] prepare to vote. Um, you know, I I I
[39:42] actually do think that that we live in a
[39:44] time partly because of us that people
[39:46] process this stuff so so quickly that
[39:48] it's entirely possible that by next
[39:50] spring uh he'll be rolling out
[39:52] something. The question is with
[39:54] everybody telling him he's got to change
[39:56] course, you know, crisis has a thousand
[39:58] kvitzers. Uh, is he is he
[40:02] >> Babcock said is he of a is he of a mind
[40:04] to do that? Or as the or as John and
[40:06] David describe, are they saying, you
[40:07] know what, we got here, we got
[40:08] reelected, we got most of our agenda
[40:10] passed in the first years. Just give us
[40:11] a little time. We got our conservative
[40:12] base back because we lanced the Harriet
[40:15] Meyers problem. So, I'm not so sure
[40:16] they've lost control.
[40:17] >> Uh, John, people have said a lot, the
[40:19] president, one way to get the agenda
[40:21] back, if in fact he's lost it, is that
[40:23] you launch big bold ideas. He launched a
[40:26] big bold idea in social security,
[40:29] probably the biggest boldest idea in
[40:31] American politics in a sense given how
[40:33] many people it affects and it fell flat.
[40:36] So what what are the big bold domestic
[40:38] ideas in a country that seems to have
[40:41] growing doubts over the president
[40:43] himself?
[40:44] >> Well, look, social security completely
[40:45] crashed and burned. And you know, when
[40:47] he says, "I want to get back and do my
[40:49] job. I want to get back and and and do
[40:51] the work of the people." It reminds me
[40:53] of what President Clinton said. But it's
[40:55] important to remember when President
[40:56] Clinton was saying that he had a 65% job
[40:59] approval. Right now George Bush has a
[41:01] 38% job approval. So when people hear
[41:03] that that he's going to just go back and
[41:05] do the same thing, I think they say to
[41:07] themselves, "Oh no, uh you know, what is
[41:09] he talking about?" I think that, you
[41:11] know, he hasn't done much about energy.
[41:12] He hasn't done uh anything to really uh
[41:16] deal with the middle class squeeze in
[41:17] this country. He's got a real problem in
[41:19] Iraq. So he's got his hands full. And
[41:22] you know, I think at this point, he's
[41:24] got a team that if if nothing else has
[41:27] their credibility in shreds. You know,
[41:28] the one thing we know that's unassalable
[41:30] is that Carl Rove went out told Scott
[41:32] Mlullen to say he had nothing to do with
[41:34] it. We know that was not true. And uh
[41:36] you know, I think he'd be well advised
[41:38] to clean house, but I don't think he's
[41:39] going to do it.
[41:40] >> David, on the whole house cleaning
[41:42] thing, I mean, to me, it it uh it it
[41:44] almost cuts two ways. Um I I I gather
[41:47] there's some advantage in bringing new
[41:48] blood in and people are tired. It's it's
[41:51] exhausting work. On the other hand, it
[41:52] feels or it can play as desperate.
[41:56] >> It can, but in this case, I think the
[41:59] country would welcome someone like a
[42:00] Fred Fred Thompson, the former senator
[42:02] coming in, someone of stature of the
[42:04] kind of person that Howard Baker came in
[42:07] with Ronald Reagan. here on the
[42:09] substantive side, Aaron, I think he's
[42:10] got this problem that um you when Reagan
[42:13] was there and he was looking for new
[42:15] initiatives after Iran country, he had
[42:16] Gorbachev as a partner and they they
[42:18] went engaged in summits and they got an
[42:20] arms control treaty and that really
[42:22] helped as as as a part of the
[42:24] substantive recovery. With George W.
[42:26] Bush, you know, the next big decision
[42:27] he's got to make is on the Supreme Court
[42:29] and every indication is that he is going
[42:31] to choose a fight that he's going to go
[42:33] to someone who's, you know, who's a
[42:35] strong conservative who may well
[42:37] alienate and arouse the the center and
[42:40] the and the left in the Congress and
[42:41] he'll have a huge fight on his hands if
[42:43] he were to do that. If he can't find a
[42:45] sort of a John Roberts Jr. and maybe
[42:47] McConnell would be that kind of Michael
[42:49] McConnell of of Denver would be that
[42:51] kind of candidate. If he can't find that
[42:52] kind of person and he gets a fight, then
[42:54] I think his capacity to reach out and
[42:56] heal and and and Bill Bridges is is
[42:58] really going to be destroyed for a long
[43:01] time to come.
[43:01] >> Jeeoff, let me give you the last word
[43:03] here. Um, is this a moment uh I don't
[43:05] think the president will call you and
[43:06] ask you for advice, but if he's watching
[43:08] tonight, is this a moment to fight or uh
[43:11] switch in as the old ad went?
[43:14] >> It may be a moment, if I may quote
[43:15] Patrick Fitzgerald, to take a deep
[43:17] breath.
[43:17] >> Uh cuz there is one great advantage that
[43:20] George W. Bush has, which is the other
[43:21] party. One pretty influential Republican
[43:23] said to me this week, you know, the
[43:24] wheels are coming off. We're in trouble.
[43:25] He says, "If the Democrats weren't brain
[43:27] dead, we'd really be in trouble."
[43:28] >> Yeah. So,
[43:29] >> uh Jeff, it's good to see you. David and
[43:32] John, thank you for your time tonight.
[43:33] Appreciate it very much. Coming up, Carl
[43:35] Rove. He's off the hook, at least for
[43:37] now. Is he out of the woods? Our legal
[43:39] analyst, Jeffrey Tubman, joins us to
[43:41] talk about that and some of the other
[43:43] unknowns in all of this. Things we'd
[43:46] like to know. We'll take a break first
[43:48] from New York and around the world. This
[43:50] is News Night.
[44:07] I served 85 days in jail because of my
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[46:35] >> ORBITS. It's that easy.
[46:37] >> WMD, a major argument for war in Iraq.
[46:41] Now, insiders open up. Don't miss the
[46:44] critically acclaimed CNN presents Dead
[46:46] Wrong. Inside an intelligence meltdown,
[46:49] CNN coming up next.
[47:06] Any notion that anyone might have that
[47:09] there's a different standard for a high
[47:11] official, that this is somehow singling
[47:12] out obstruction of justice of perjury is
[47:14] upside down. If we if these facts are
[47:17] true, if we were to walk away from this
[47:20] and not charge obstruction of justice as
[47:22] perjury, we might as well just hand in
[47:23] our jobs.
[47:28] And that's Scooter Scooter Libby
[47:29] arriving uh at his home. These pictures
[47:32] just in being driven to his home in
[47:35] Mlan, Virginia on what is uh u as he put
[47:38] it, a very sad day for him and his
[47:41] family. He issued a statement saying he
[47:43] expects to be exonerated, but he's uh no
[47:46] doubt got a long and difficult year
[47:48] ahead. His name was James McCor Jr. and
[47:51] for those of you who are Watergate
[47:53] history buffs, old enough to remember,
[47:55] he was the Watergate burglar who first
[47:57] broke facing a long prison term and a
[47:59] tough as nails judge. Mr. McCord spilled
[48:02] the beans, as they say in the bee
[48:04] movies. But will Scooter Libby are there
[48:06] even more beans to spill? Here to take
[48:09] us through some of the knowns and
[48:10] unknowns in the indictment today and the
[48:13] investigation are senior legal analyst
[48:15] Jeffrey Tubin. Um
[48:18] do you think that they'll try and deal
[48:20] with uh Mr. Libby or is he a high enough
[48:23] fish or high enough some animal?
[48:28] >> Um I no I think this case will go to
[48:30] trial. I think if there was a plea
[48:32] bargain to be made it would have been
[48:33] made before indictment. Um he would have
[48:35] come in and plea. I I think the the the
[48:39] chance the time for dealing was before I
[48:42] think this case is going to trial.
[48:43] >> Um I I was in a conversation you may or
[48:46] may not have heard with John Cenounu,
[48:47] the senator, uh earlier and I said,
[48:49] "Yeah, I'd really like to hear from the
[48:51] vice president there. There's a few
[48:52] questions of the vice president. Are
[48:54] there questions you wouldn't mind asking
[48:55] the vice president of the United States
[48:56] about his relationship to this and his
[48:58] right-hand man?"
[48:59] >> Oh, it's astonishing. I mean, you know,
[49:01] President Bush answers questions all the
[49:03] time. I I don't I mean, Vice President
[49:06] Cheney lives in a bubble like no public
[49:09] official I have ever seen. Here he is
[49:11] involved in a very serious criminal
[49:13] case. He has never answered questions on
[49:15] this subject. He barely ever appears in
[49:18] public except reading reading speeches.
[49:21] But, you know, he's been president for
[49:23] five vice president for five years and
[49:25] he's been uh
[49:28] slipped there. It could uh what would
[49:30] you ask him if you could ask him? Uh uh
[49:32] one good one.
[49:34] >> Describe your role in the dis when when
[49:36] did you know about Victoria uh Valerie
[49:41] Wilson Valer Valerie Pla Valerie Pla
[49:43] Wilson's uh
[49:46] >> identity and describe all your
[49:48] conversations with Skooter Libby about
[49:50] that. We we we think we sort of know
[49:52] that he calls George Tenant and gets
[49:54] this information. I forget the date, but
[49:57] don't I I think the thing I want to know
[49:59] is did you say let's go out and trash
[50:01] the guy? I mean, you probably say it
[50:02] more elegantly, but something like that.
[50:04] >> And that's and and that's what is
[50:07] interesting important about his role.
[50:09] His the actions described in the
[50:11] indictment are not improper or illegal.
[50:14] And and it sort of certain makes a
[50:16] certain amount of sense. He says this
[50:18] guy Wilson surfaces in in in the press.
[50:20] He calls the CIA, says, "Who is this
[50:22] guy? What's the story?" And then he
[50:23] tells his uh chief of staff about him.
[50:27] The question though is what did he tell
[50:29] him to do about it? And what does
[50:32] Scooter Liberty think about that?
[50:33] >> Right. I I almost want to apologize to
[50:35] this question because I don't think it's
[50:36] knowable, but I'm going ask it anyways
[50:38] because I want it on the table here.
[50:39] Here you got a guy, Mr. Libby, who is a
[50:41] lawyer. I think Yale educated lawyer.
[50:44] >> Very smart.
[50:45] >> Love Columbia Law School.
[50:46] >> Okay. Very smart guy. In any case, um,
[50:50] he's got to know that there are notes in
[50:52] these conversations. There are records
[50:53] of meetings. Why do you go in front of
[50:56] the grand jury and lie?
[50:57] >> It is unbelievable, isn't it? I I But
[51:00] but in white collar cases, that is
[51:02] almost always the defense, which is
[51:05] >> what I wouldn't be that stupid.
[51:06] >> Yeah, he couldn't be that stupid. It was
[51:08] the defense in the Martha Stewart case.
[51:10] How could she be so stupid? This
[51:11] intelligent woman. You know what? People
[51:13] do stupid things all the time. And that
[51:15] that's usually the prosecutor's
[51:16] response. that a lot of people get
[51:18] convicted. They hope they don't get
[51:19] caught.
[51:20] >> Thank you. You've had a long day.
[51:21] >> It's been a long day.
[51:21] >> I know it has. Thank you very much.
[51:23] Coming up, from failed intelligence to
[51:25] indictments and the war in Iraq, how
[51:27] they all may tie together to lead us to
[51:30] this day and this program, which is News
[51:34] Night.
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[52:12] CNN Saturday. CNN's Dan Loian
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[52:17] Trust CNN to take a hard look at the
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[54:27] Larry King 9 Eastern.
[54:32] We learned today that a Marine from Ohio
[54:34] was killed in Iraq on Thursday. Lance
[54:37] Corporal Robert Efield Jr. was 23 years
[54:40] old. As the war continues, so of course
[54:42] do the questions. Today the special
[54:44] counsel Patrick Fitzgerald was asked if
[54:46] the indictment was a vindication that
[54:49] the Bush administration took the country
[54:51] to war on a false premise. This is how
[54:53] he answered.
[54:55] This indictment is not about the war.
[54:57] This indictment is not about the
[54:59] proprietor of the war. And people who
[55:01] sue who who believe firly in the war
[55:03] effort, people who oppose it, people who
[55:04] are have mixed feelings about it should
[55:07] not look to this indictment for any
[55:08] resolution of how they feel or any
[55:10] vindication of how they feel. I think
[55:12] there was a more interesting person
[55:13] today by the way than Mr. Fitzgerald.
[55:15] Democrats disagree with him. They
[55:17] believe the indictment has everything to
[55:19] do with the war, how we got to war.
[55:21] Partisan, yes, but it is part of the
[55:23] national debate. Our national security
[55:25] correspondent, David Ensor, has been
[55:27] doing an incredible amount of work and
[55:29] good work on the intelligence that led
[55:32] up to the war and how it came to be. And
[55:33] David joins us now. David, I think that
[55:36] uh people's perspective on this is, you
[55:39] know, people who are opposed to the war
[55:41] say that it wasn't just that the
[55:43] intelligence was wrong, it's that the
[55:44] intelligence was cooked.
[55:46] >> Yeah.
[55:47] >> Do we know? Can we answer that for them?
[55:50] Um, cooked is probably a little too
[55:53] strong a word. Uh, you know, people in
[55:56] the intelligence community and I, let's
[55:57] be honest, I also thought that Iraq had
[56:01] weapons of mass destruction. They had
[56:03] used them on their own Saddam had used
[56:05] them on his own people. He'd used them
[56:06] against Iran. Uh, there were chemical
[56:08] weapons that were unaccounted for after
[56:10] the war. So, there was lots of good
[56:12] logical reason to think there were
[56:13] weapons of mass destruction there. The
[56:16] amazing thing is there were not. And you
[56:18] know, I've tried to to find out why how
[56:22] this could go so badly wrong, which is
[56:24] part of what I guess we're going to be
[56:25] be showing people in the next hour that
[56:27] this this look at how this could go so
[56:30] badly wrong. But I was also today at
[56:31] that uh press conference uh that you
[56:34] just mentioned, Mr. Fitzgerald's press
[56:36] conference. And there were what was so
[56:38] striking there was there were lots of
[56:40] questions about, well, isn't this really
[56:42] about Iraq? Isn't this really about the
[56:44] the WMD? and he he of course it's in his
[56:47] interest to be as narrow as possible to
[56:49] say no it's just about lying that's all
[56:51] it's about I don't want to go there
[56:53] >> but for most of the people in the
[56:54] country whether they're for or against
[56:56] the war that's what this is really about
[56:58] in political
[56:58] >> terms right at some level this is about
[57:01] Joe Wilson saying I'm not I'm not saying
[57:05] he's right about this I'm just saying
[57:06] what he said is that they took the
[57:08] country to war when they knew the
[57:10] evidence was at least ambiguous and they
[57:12] never framed it in an ambiguous way
[57:14] right? But they did believe there were
[57:16] weapons of mass destruction in Iraq and
[57:18] as I say a lot of people did, myself
[57:20] included. Uh now that turned out to be
[57:22] wrong and that may not have been the
[57:24] real main motivation for going to Iraq
[57:26] in the first place, which is yet another
[57:28] question. Um
[57:30] >> deal
[57:32] um as you mentioned, we'll take a deeper
[57:34] look at this in the hour ahead. Um we
[57:37] appreciate you spending a few minutes
[57:38] with us uh in anticipation of that to
[57:42] sort of set the stage. Thank you very
[57:43] much. My pleasure.
[57:45] >> David Ensor tonight.
[57:48] Uh we'll take a break. We'll continue in
[57:50] a moment.
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[59:31] >> CNN Sunday. Indictments in the CIA leak
[59:34] probe. A Supreme Court nominee steps
[59:36] down. How will the Bush administration
[59:38] recover? Senate Minority Leader Harry
[59:39] Reid and Judiciary Committee Chairman
[59:41] Arnold Spectre. Join Wolf in late
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[60:07] Well, good evening again. In a moment,
[60:08] CNN presents Dead Wrong. First, here's
[60:11] what's making news at this moment. Vice
[60:13] President Cheny's chief of staff,
[60:15] right-hand man, Scooter Libby, has
[60:16] resigned after being indicted today on
[60:19] charges of lying and obstructing
[60:21] justice. Mr. Libby says he is confident
[60:23] he'll be exonerated. President Bush
[60:26] praised Libbyy's government service and
[60:27] noted, as we all should, that Liby is
[60:29] considered innocent until proven guilty.
[60:32] The vice president accepted Mr. Libbyy's
[60:34] resignation with regret. The grand jury
[60:36] that indicted Libby has been trying to
[60:38] determine who leaked the identity of CIA
[60:41] operative Valerie Pla. This claim's
[60:44] husband, former US Ambassador Joe
[60:46] Wilson, says the case involves charges
[60:48] that quote go to the very heart of our
[60:51] democracy. We look at the questions of
[60:54] how we ended up in Iraq in the CNN
[60:57] presents Dead Wrong, which is