This Week (ABC) - 2009-05-03

Channel: malgent

Transcript

Language: English (original, YouTube automatic captions)

[0:00] KING W News, Channel 8 with the news.

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[0:27] Good morning and welcome to this week.

[0:30] Justice Souter retires. I find the the

[0:33] workload of what I do sufficiently great

[0:35] that I undergo a sort of annual

[0:38] intellectual lobotomy. I will seek

[0:40] someone who understands that justice

[0:42] isn't about some abstract legal theory.

[0:45] >> As President Obama prepares to make his

[0:47] mark on the Supreme Court, our

[0:49] headliners are the senators who must

[0:50] ratify his choice. The chairman of the

[0:52] Judiciary Committee, Patrick Leahy, and

[0:54] its longest-serving Republican, Orrin

[0:56] Hatch.

[0:57] >> [snorts]

[0:57] >> Then, swine flu continues to spread. Has

[1:00] the worst passed, or is it still to

[1:02] come? We'll ask the federal team in

[1:04] charge.

[1:05] And Senator Specter switches sides. I've

[1:08] decided to be a candidate for the

[1:10] Democratic primary. What will it mean

[1:12] for Obama's agenda and the GOP's future?

[1:15] That in the rest of the week's politics

[1:16] on our round table with George Will,

[1:18] Gwen Ifill of PBS, Jerry Seib of The

[1:21] Wall Street Journal, and Paul Krugman of

[1:23] The New York Times. And, as always, the

[1:27] Sunday funnies. SEE ALL THOSE PEOPLE ON

[1:28] THE NEWS WALKING AROUND WEARING THOSE

[1:30] SURGICAL MASKS, HUH? SO, LIKE MICHAEL

[1:32] JACKSON, NOT SO CRAZY, HUH? YEAH.

[1:36] >> [music]

[1:36] >> FROM THE HEART OF THE nation's capital,

[1:39] This Week with ABC News Chief Washington

[1:42] Correspondent, George Stephanopoulos,

[1:45] live from the Newseum on Pennsylvania

[1:48] Avenue.

[1:51] By Friday, David Souter's wish to quit

[1:53] the Supreme Court had become

[1:54] Washington's worst-kept secret. But,

[1:56] President Obama stage managed a bit of a

[1:58] surprise that afternoon when he crashed

[2:00] the daily briefing.

[2:02] There's a job to do, you got to do it

[2:04] yourself. After thanking Justice Souter

[2:06] for his service, the president described

[2:07] his ideal justice. A person of

[2:09] intelligence, excellence, integrity, and

[2:12] empathy.

[2:13] >> I will seek someone who understands that

[2:15] justice isn't about some abstract legal

[2:18] theory or footnote in a casebook.

[2:21] It is also about how our laws affect the

[2:23] daily realities of people's lives,

[2:25] whether they can make a living

[2:27] and care for their families, whether

[2:29] they feel safe in their homes, and

[2:31] welcome in their own nation. Which

[2:33] brings us to our headliners, Senator

[2:34] Patrick Leahy, the chairman of the

[2:35] Senate Judiciary Committee, and its

[2:37] former chairman, Republican Orrin Hatch.

[2:39] Gentlemen, welcome to you both. And and

[2:40] and and Senator Hatch, let me begin with

[2:42] you. What did you make of this criteria

[2:44] the president laid out? Well,

[2:46] it's a matter of great concern. If he's

[2:48] saying that

[2:49] he wants to pick people who will take

[2:50] sides, he's also said that a judge has

[2:53] to be a person with empathy. What does

[2:54] that mean? Usually, that's a code word

[2:56] for an activist judge. If but he also

[2:59] said that uh

[3:01] that

[3:02] he's going to select judges on the basis

[3:04] of their personal politics, their

[3:05] personal feelings, their personal

[3:07] preferences. Now, you know, that that

[3:10] those are all code words for an activist

[3:12] judge who's going to

[3:14] you know, be partisan on the bench. He

[3:15] did also say he wants someone who

[3:17] respects the rule of law and the limits

[3:18] of the judicial role. So, it sounds like

[3:20] you're saying that you think there's a

[3:21] tension between following the law and

[3:24] following your feelings when you're a

[3:25] judge.

[3:26] >> Well, I don't think there should be a

[3:27] litmus test or any set of litmus tests

[3:30] when you pick people for the high court.

[3:32] And I I suspect that the president

[3:35] understands that. He's a He's a very

[3:37] bright guy, charismatic,

[3:39] intelligent, likable.

[3:41] And I'm hoping that he'll pick somebody

[3:43] of great dimension. Now, we all know

[3:44] he's going to pick a more liberal

[3:46] justice.

[3:47] Um

[3:48] their side will

[3:50] make sure that it's a pro-abortion

[3:52] justice.

[3:53] Uh don't think anybody has any illusions

[3:55] about that. The question is are they

[3:57] qualified?

[3:58] Are they going to be people who will who

[4:00] will

[4:01] be fair to the rich, the poor, the weak,

[4:03] the strong, the the

[4:06] the sickly, disabled and and and yet

[4:10] give justice to those who may not be so

[4:12] strong.

[4:12] >> Leahy, let me bring you in on this

[4:13] because what Senator Hatch is saying

[4:14] there I've heard from a lot of other

[4:16] conservatives. This fear that the

[4:17] president's focus on empathy is a a code

[4:21] for bringing a judicial activist to the

[4:23] court.

[4:24] Well, I I've known President Obama long

[4:27] enough. He doesn't need to use code

[4:28] words. He speaks very plainly and very

[4:31] directly. I think that's why

[4:33] he won such a resounding victory

[4:36] in in November.

[4:38] I talked with President Obama shortly

[4:41] before he did that press conference.

[4:45] And I think I have a pretty good sense.

[4:47] I'm going to be meeting with him when I

[4:49] return to Washington from Vermont. I

[4:53] have a pretty good sense of what he has

[4:55] in mind for

[4:56] a a justice. What I would argue I what I

[5:00] would

[5:00] >> to know that bit. What what what I would

[5:03] argue is you walk in the Supreme Court.

[5:05] Over the doorway there's a great big

[5:07] piece of Vermont marble.

[5:09] And it's [clears throat] engraved on it

[5:11] says equal justice under law. That's

[5:13] what you That's what you want to have.

[5:15] We've had a very activist court. We had

[5:18] an activist court that that

[5:21] made a decision that allowed

[5:23] employers to

[5:26] covertly discriminate against women so

[5:28] they women wouldn't get paid equally. We

[5:31] in the Congress reversed that with a

[5:34] law. In fact, the first law that

[5:35] President Obama signed into law. I think

[5:38] he wants to have somebody who treat

[5:39] people all the same whether they're

[5:41] Republicans or Democrats, men, women,

[5:43] >> Let me let me press on that a little bit

[5:45] Senator Leahy because that have spoken

[5:46] with the president about it. I just want

[5:48] to know a couple of things about that.

[5:49] Uh number one, did you recommend uh any

[5:52] specific candidates uh to the president?

[5:54] And number two, cuz others have not been

[5:55] shy about recommending of potential

[5:57] candidates. Your colleague, Senator

[5:59] Schumer, has said the president should

[6:00] consider highly consider a Latino

[6:03] choice. I think there's a wide

[6:04] expectation throughout Washington that

[6:06] the president will pick a woman. Um is

[6:08] that your understanding? And does

[6:10] President Obama risk a backlash if he

[6:12] doesn't pick a woman?

[6:14] Well, I think one of the reasons why the

[6:16] president and I get along well is that

[6:18] we have conversations you you you don't

[6:20] hear about them. You don't You don't

[6:22] read about them afterward. I will make

[6:24] recommendations some specific

[6:26] recommendations to him. I've also

[6:28] recommended that he

[6:30] uh sit down with both the Republican and

[6:32] Democratic leadership talk about this.

[6:35] Now, ultimately, he's the one who has to

[6:36] make the choice who he wants to

[6:38] nominate. We in the Senate then have to

[6:40] decide whether we will consent to that

[6:42] nomination. But, I think he is eager to

[6:45] seek the advice

[6:46] of senators of both parties.

[6:49] Uh I I think he has some very uh some

[6:52] people that he would like to see the

[6:53] type of people he'd like to see number

[6:56] He was a constitutional law

[6:57] >> I I do remember that. Should it be a

[6:59] woman, Senator?

[7:01] I I I would like to see uh certainly

[7:03] more women on the on the court. Having

[7:06] only one woman on the Supreme Court does

[7:08] not reflect the makeup of the

[7:11] of the United States. I think we should

[7:13] have more women. We should have more

[7:14] minorities. I would like to see more

[7:16] people from outside the uh

[7:20] judicial monastery. Somebody who's had

[7:22] some real life experience, not just as a

[7:25] a judge.

[7:26] >> Let me bring Senator

[7:27] Let me bring Senator Hatch back in on

[7:29] this, because there there a lot of names

[7:30] are being bandied about right now. Three

[7:32] of the most prominent names being

[7:33] mentioned are are two appeals court

[7:35] judges, Sonia Sotomayor. Uh she serves

[7:38] out of New York. Also, Judge Diane Wood,

[7:40] serving out of Chicago, another member

[7:41] of the Appeals Court, and the new

[7:42] Solicitor General, Elena Kagan. And some

[7:45] conservatives have already taken off on

[7:48] these choices. Let me show one, Wendy

[7:49] Long run from the Judicial Confirmation

[7:52] Network says, "Obama can make it even

[7:54] more of a far left judicial activist

[7:56] court for a long time to come if he

[7:58] appoints radicals like Diane Wood, Sonia

[8:01] Sotomayor, and Elena Kagan. A new

[8:03] justice in this mold would just entrench

[8:04] a bad majority for a long time." Do you

[8:07] share that view?

[8:08] Well, I I share the view that he should

[8:10] not appoint radicals to the court, and I

[8:12] share the view that he should appoint

[8:14] somebody who basically will obey the law

[8:17] and not put their own policy preferences

[8:19] into law. And that's what bothers me

[8:21] about some of the comments that the

[8:23] president has made. He's bright enough

[8:24] to know that those comments basically

[8:26] indicate that politics, preferences,

[8:29] personal preferences, and feelings that

[8:32] might take the place in

[8:34] in being being impartial

[8:36] in deciding cases based upon the law and

[8:38] not upon not upon politics.

[8:41] >> were confirmed to their current

[8:42] positions with the support of many

[8:43] Republicans, including you. Are they

[8:45] radicals?

[8:46] I don't think they're radicals, but

[8:48] there's no question that they are on the

[8:50] far left of the spectrum. And

[8:52] to be honest with you, I don't expect

[8:53] the president to pick somebody in the

[8:55] center or on the far right. But

[8:57] you know, it would be it would be a slam

[9:00] dunk if he picked somebody who was who

[9:01] was center left like Souter. Souter

[9:04] Souter became very liberal, but he also

[9:06] stood for a lot of principles.

[9:08] >> said that suggested to President Clinton

[9:10] that he should pick a Justices Breyer

[9:13] and Ginsburg. You wrote about that in

[9:14] your book. Do you have any

[9:15] recommendations for President Obama? No,

[9:17] I'm not going to make any

[9:18] recommendations unless he calls me. If

[9:19] he calls me, I'll be happy to sit down

[9:21] with him. We get along well. I've been

[9:23] out of the White House a number of

[9:24] times. I have a great admiration for him

[9:26] as and his abilities.

[9:28] I hope that he'll pick somebody who

[9:29] will, like I say, not put their own

[9:32] personal predilections into law, but

[9:35] follow the law and do what really

[9:37] what really is right.

[9:38] >> Senator Leahy, let me bring you back in

[9:39] on this. You You heard what what Senator

[9:41] Hatch said there. Meanwhile, on the left

[9:44] of your party, you're hearing a lot of

[9:46] liberals say the president shouldn't pay

[9:48] any attention

[9:49] to to the Republican Party on this pick.

[9:51] He should pick a full-throated

[9:53] liberal, someone who's really going to

[9:55] move

[9:56] the court. One example comes from Nan

[9:59] Nan Aaron of the president of the

[10:00] Alliance for Justice. She says even

[10:02] before Senator Arlen Specter announced

[10:04] he was changing parties and Al Franken's

[10:05] Minnesota victory was clear. Republicans

[10:08] in Congress were losing strength as

[10:09] fewer voters identified with their

[10:10] agenda. They should not be allowed to

[10:12] stand in the way of a nominee who will

[10:15] uphold the Constitution.

[10:18] Do you

[10:19] Do you think the president should follow

[10:20] that course? Probably will have 60 votes

[10:22] soon. Pick someone who can get there on

[10:23] Democratic votes alone.

[10:25] It takes 51 votes to

[10:28] to confirm somebody and I would assume

[10:30] that we we never filibuster justices

[10:35] of the Supreme Court. We don't do it for

[10:37] anybody.

[10:37] >> Justice Alito, didn't you? No.

[10:40] We don't filibuster for

[10:43] for either side. And so we have There's

[10:46] going to be a vote up up or down.

[10:49] I fully expect that. I think the last

[10:51] time there was any kind of a successful

[10:53] filibuster was Abe Fortas and that was a

[10:55] Democratic

[10:56] That was successful but the Democrats

[10:58] did try to filibuster Justice Alito, if

[11:00] I remember correctly, sir.

[11:01] >> There was

[11:03] There was a There was a cursory vote

[11:06] that everybody knew would not

[11:08] would not succeed on the motion to

[11:11] proceed. I mean, now we're getting down

[11:13] into the weeds. The fact is Justice

[11:14] Alito, I did not vote for him.

[11:17] Senator Hatch did. He got both

[11:20] Democratic and Republican votes, just as

[11:23] Chief Justice Roberts, whom I did vote

[11:25] for,

[11:27] got both Democratic and Republican

[11:30] votes. The fact of the matter is we will

[11:31] have an up or down vote and whoever it's

[11:33] going to be and I would hope the

[11:34] president would go with his instincts.

[11:37] Look what he's done with his cabinet.

[11:38] He's had pretty pretty darn good cabinet

[11:41] choices. Uh and I think he's going to

[11:43] make a very good choice here. When you

[11:45] will hear a lot on the far right or the

[11:48] far left who will say who he should or

[11:50] shouldn't uh go with. Remember, a lot of

[11:53] the left-wing groups uh uh picketed

[11:57] actually picketed the Senate building

[11:58] that I'm in

[12:00] against me because I was going to vote

[12:01] for David Souter. They said it'd be

[12:03] terrible, the end of the the end of the

[12:05] world if we uh confirm David Souter.

[12:09] Now, those same groups think David

[12:10] Souter was a great justice. The fact of

[12:13] the matter is that the president will

[12:15] make a good choice just as he has with

[12:17] his cabinet.

[12:18] >> wants this in place by

[12:19] >> we have to vote for it. He He wants this

[12:21] in place by the first Monday in October,

[12:23] as you know. And that would mean that uh

[12:25] getting this done he hopes that the

[12:27] White House hopes by the August recess.

[12:29] Is that possible?

[12:30] Well, one

[12:32] we certainly will have somebody in

[12:34] place. It'd be irresponsible for you to

[12:35] not have somebody in place by the

[12:37] beginning of the

[12:39] um October session. Uh I'll decide when

[12:42] we'll have the hearing on on the person

[12:46] after they've been uh named and after I

[12:49] consulted whoever's maybe weren't to

[12:51] tell me who's going to be the ranking

[12:52] member

[12:52] >> you set me up there, Senator. I want to

[12:54] bring I want to bring you Senator Hatch

[12:55] back in on this.

[12:56] >> with the

[12:59] Republican leadership as well as the

[13:01] Democratic leadership. I will set a date

[13:03] uh for this, but I want to make sure

[13:05] everybody has a chance to see who the

[13:07] president's nominated, they have a

[13:09] chance to see their background, so on.

[13:10] But Orrin, tell me who's going to be

[13:12] leading the Republicans. Go for it,

[13:14] Senator.

[13:14] >> Okay, let me let me just say one other

[13:16] thing. [laughter]

[13:18] Let me say one other thing.

[13:19] >> good question. Yeah, well, we're going

[13:21] to get an answer to it. Well, I'll I'll

[13:22] I'll try to answer that, but what what

[13:23] is interesting here is that the

[13:25] President Obama himself voted against

[13:27] both Roberts and Alito.

[13:30] Now, these are two of the best nominees

[13:31] I've seen in my whole time here, and

[13:32] I've had an influence on everybody

[13:34] except Stevens. And so has my friend

[13:38] Pat.

[13:39] And that worries me a little bit. Pat

[13:40] voted for Roberts. He did He did vote

[13:42] against Alito, and they did

[13:44] want to filibuster Alito. No question

[13:46] about that. And it was in along that

[13:49] vein. Now,

[13:50] I suspect that that

[13:53] Grassley has first choice to be I'm the

[13:55] ranking member on Judiciary. Would you

[13:57] actually have first choice if you seek a

[13:58] waiver? Are you not going to seek the

[13:59] waiver?

[14:00] >> I do not I would not. Of course not. But

[14:02] Grassley has first choice, then Kyl if

[14:04] Grassley stays on Finance. And if Kyl

[14:08] stays in leadership, then Jeff Sessions.

[14:10] So, any of those three could wind up

[14:12] being

[14:12] >> then Senator Sessions to be the ranking

[14:14] member now?

[14:14] >> Well, I don't know. I know that he and

[14:16] Senator Grassley are trying to work out

[14:17] something, and we'll just have to see

[14:19] what happens. But uh

[14:20] But I I suspect you know, any of those

[14:23] three will be just fine.

[14:24] Terrific. Thank you both very much for

[14:26] your time this morning.

[14:27] >> I can work with I can work with any one

[14:28] of those any one of those senators.

[14:30] They're long time long time friends.

[14:32] We'll work out things. We'll

[14:34] >> you make such a rough time Pat all those

[14:36] years?

[14:37] You guys continue this off camera. We're

[14:39] out of time right now. Thank you both

[14:40] very much.

[14:42] >> [laughter]

[14:42] >> And we are going to turn now to the

[14:43] swine flu. It continues to spread, but

[14:46] there are signs that the outbreak is

[14:47] smaller and less severe than first

[14:49] feared. Still, the government is warning

[14:51] against complacency.

[14:53] In the the media, we've been hearing a

[14:55] little bit about we're out of the woods.

[14:57] It looks like this is this is ending.

[14:59] And I want to say that while reports

[15:02] from Mexico are

[15:04] appear to be encouraging, and some are

[15:06] cautiously optimistic, we can't afford

[15:09] to let down our vigilance.

[15:13] Let me bring in the federal team in

[15:14] charge of this effort, Secretary of

[15:16] Health and Human Services Kathleen

[15:17] Sebelius, Homeland Security Secretary

[15:19] Janet Napolitano, and the acting

[15:21] director of the Center for Disease

[15:23] Control, Dr. Richard Besser. And Dr.

[15:25] Besser, let me begin with you. I know

[15:27] you guys don't want to take anything for

[15:29] granted, but a lot of scientists have

[15:31] been looking at this say there are signs

[15:33] that this virus is less potent, less

[15:35] deadly than past pandemics, and that

[15:37] some older Americans especially may have

[15:40] developed an immunity to this. What can

[15:42] you tell us right now? Your latest

[15:44] analysis of this virus. You know, what I

[15:46] can say is that we're seeing encouraging

[15:48] signs, and that's uh that makes us all

[15:51] very happy. What what we do when we we

[15:54] get a virus, we look to see

[15:56] uh does it relate to any other viruses,

[15:58] and then we look for things that are

[16:00] called virulence factors. Those things

[16:02] that in the past have been linked to

[16:04] more severe disease. And what we found

[16:07] is that we're not seeing the factors

[16:08] that were associated with the 1918

[16:11] pandemic. We're not seeing the factors

[16:13] that are were associated with other H1N1

[16:16] viruses. And that's encouraging.

[16:17] >> it's less likely to come back in a real

[16:20] strong way in the fall as the 1918 virus

[16:22] did? We can't say that. Uh every virus

[16:25] is new, and what it will do is new. And

[16:28] so you're you're hitting a a critical

[16:30] point. What will happen during this

[16:32] spring and summer? And I don't think

[16:34] it's time to let our guard down. I think

[16:36] we have to continue in an uncertain

[16:38] situation to be aggressive, and that's

[16:40] what we're doing. Uh Secretary Sebelius,

[16:42] let me bring you in on this. Of course,

[16:43] this leads to the question of a vaccine.

[16:45] Sure. Uh I know researchers are looking

[16:47] at it right now. Are you prepared to say

[16:49] we should move to full-scale production

[16:51] and distribution? What's going on right

[16:53] now, George, are two things

[16:54] simultaneously. Uh we know that seasonal

[16:57] flu year in and year out uh hits

[17:00] millions of Americans. 200,000 people

[17:02] end up in the hospital, and about 36,000

[17:05] people die every year. So, we are

[17:07] ramping up and accelerating the

[17:09] production of seasonal flu vaccine to

[17:11] make sure that we kind of clear the

[17:13] decks. At the same time, one of the

[17:14] first actions taken by the Department of

[17:17] Health and Human Services was to bring

[17:18] together the scientists, the National

[17:20] Institutes of Health,

[17:22] uh the Center for Disease Control, along

[17:24] with the um

[17:26] folks at uh Food and Drug

[17:27] Administration, who have the oversight,

[17:29] with the manufacturers to begin the

[17:32] process to develop a vaccine for H1N1.

[17:35] Uh they've identified a virus, it's

[17:38] being grown and tested as we speak, and

[17:40] ultimately the scientists will tell us

[17:42] whether or not production of that

[17:43] vaccine makes sense.

[17:45] >> And isn't there a trade-off there? I

[17:46] mean, you don't want to switch to

[17:47] production of the H1N1 vaccine cuz that

[17:49] could crowd out the ability to produce

[17:51] the seasonal flu vaccine.

[17:52] >> Well, the good news is we're in the

[17:53] right seasonal time. We can accelerate

[17:56] uh the seasonal flu vaccine, which we're

[17:58] doing right now, to be prepared and

[18:00] ready for uh what we know will hit this

[18:03] fall and winter. At the same time, we

[18:04] are in the stages of of growing the

[18:07] virus, testing it, and we can be ready

[18:09] to do both simultaneously. This isn't an

[18:11] either/or. Secretary Napolitano, the

[18:13] government has given out guidance for

[18:15] the schools uh on what they should be

[18:16] doing. If someone, as I understand it,

[18:18] is infected in a school or there's more

[18:20] than one case in a school, uh the school

[18:22] should close for up to 14 days. But you

[18:25] have not yet given out formal guidance

[18:27] on what offices, factories, and other

[18:29] workplaces should do. What should they

[18:31] be doing?

[18:32] Well, uh again, I think using common

[18:34] sense. Uh obviously schools uh you give

[18:36] guidance on because uh uh

[18:39] that's really a a primary place where

[18:40] disease gets passed one one to the next.

[18:43] Uh but we don't want to shut down the

[18:44] production capacity of the country for

[18:47] flu when that and then that's when

[18:49] that's not necessary. What we have been

[18:50] telling the private sector, we've been

[18:52] having regular uh conference calls,

[18:54] whatever, through the private sector is,

[18:56] "Dust off your plans for how you deal

[18:58] with seasonal flu. What do you do when

[19:00] your absenteeism rate goes up? Uh what

[19:02] do you do for telecommuting, for

[19:04] example? What do you do uh to make sure

[19:06] that if you have to restrict um some

[19:08] production, you you move it to to places

[19:10] that are concentrated in some places as

[19:12] opposed to others. You know, every

[19:13] business every business owner has a

[19:16] different way of handling this. The

[19:18] number one thing is for people who are

[19:21] sick not to go to work.

[19:23] Once they don't go to work, we can begin

[19:25] the process of containing the spread of

[19:26] the virus.

[19:26] >> And and every you have to get the

[19:28] balance right and we've seen the variety

[19:30] of responses to the crisis. In Hong Kong

[19:32] they they closed up quarantined that

[19:34] entire hotel yesterday when there there

[19:37] was one infection. We saw an example

[19:39] just the other day of a plane

[19:41] being grounded. Is that an overreaction?

[19:44] You know, we take our guidance from the

[19:47] best of science can give us and we have

[19:49] great scientists at the centers for

[19:50] disease control and what they told us

[19:53] was if you're sick, you should stay

[19:55] home. If you have a child who is sick,

[19:57] you should keep that child at home.

[20:00] If if you have sick children in a

[20:01] school, you should close that school,

[20:03] but that's not to let all the kids go to

[20:05] the mall, it's to keep them all at home.

[20:08] And that's the way you begin to mitigate

[20:09] the effect of the spread of this new

[20:11] flu.

[20:11] >> Real common sense standard. And Dr.

[20:13] Messonnier, let me come back to to you

[20:15] now. You said we're not out of the woods

[20:17] yet. We have to be on guard, but what

[20:19] are the signs you're looking for to say,

[20:21] you know what, this isn't as bad as we

[20:23] feared. We are going to get through

[20:24] this. A number of things we're we're

[20:26] looking for. One is we're looking for an

[20:28] answer for why what we are hearing

[20:30] coming out of Mexico looks so different

[20:33] from what we were seeing here initially.

[20:35] We're starting to get some answers

[20:36] there. Here around the country, what

[20:38] we're looking for is how easily does it

[20:40] spread and what is the severity of

[20:42] disease and we're getting answers to

[20:44] that as well.

[20:45] >> It's not spreading that easily, right?

[20:46] >> Well, it is spreading. It's spreading

[20:48] quite easily and and we have 160

[20:50] reported cases, 21 states. We expect

[20:53] today that we're going to be confirming

[20:55] cases in in far more states than that.

[20:57] So, it does spread very easily. The word

[20:59] out of New York City where they had a

[21:01] school cluster is it spread very rapidly

[21:03] through that school, but what they were

[21:05] seeing was disease that was not that

[21:07] severe, and when it transmitted to

[21:09] people in the families, they were seeing

[21:11] disease that was not that severe. And

[21:12] that's encouraging. Secretary Sebelius

[21:14] uh

[21:15] President Obama often um

[21:17] talks about the problems he inherited uh

[21:19] from the past administration. He's not

[21:21] shy about that at all. Yet, President

[21:23] Bush and his team did develop a national

[21:25] strategy for for influenza coming out of

[21:28] the whole avian flu experience. Is this

[21:30] an example where the Obama

[21:32] administration inherited a solution

[21:34] uh from the Bush administration, and is

[21:37] the strategy you're following now rooted

[21:39] in the Bush strategy?

[21:40] Well, I don't think there's any question

[21:41] the planning that's been done um

[21:45] in the last 5 years has been

[21:46] extraordinarily helpful. States are much

[21:49] more prepared than they were uh 4 and 5

[21:52] years ago with emergency plans. The

[21:54] private sector has been engaged in that.

[21:56] In fact, the first time I met Dr. Besser

[21:58] was not involved in this situation, but

[22:00] he came to lead a meta-leadership

[22:02] conference that co-hosted by Kansas and

[22:04] Missouri with a thousand uh people from

[22:07] the private and public sector to talk

[22:08] about a pandemic flu outbreak. So,

[22:11] people have been prepared and ready, and

[22:13] I don't think there's any question that

[22:14] President former President Bush had a

[22:17] strategy, and resources were put in, and

[22:20] that's all very good news. And you know,

[22:22] the aggressive

[22:24] uh ability to get out in front of uh a

[22:27] virus like this is is so very important,

[22:30] and I think President Obama um made sure

[22:33] that his team was in place early on,

[22:35] that we

[22:36] uh acted on this uh

[22:39] appropriately, that we're working with

[22:40] public-private partnership, and that

[22:42] we're really ready to uh do what it

[22:45] takes to keep the American public safe

[22:47] and secure, which is the number one

[22:48] priority.

[22:49] >> That hasn't meant, Secretary Napolitano,

[22:50] you've been uh immune from criticism.

[22:53] Uh you seem to take it from all sides up

[22:54] on Capitol Hill. This week, a lot of

[22:56] senators saying you should be shutting

[22:58] the border down right now. Yet, uh on

[23:00] talk radio, complaints that the media uh

[23:04] and others are hyping the threat. Take a

[23:05] look.

[23:07] You look at the degree and the level to

[23:09] which the media is elevating this to a

[23:11] panic.

[23:12] And you have to say, "Why?" Well,

[23:13] because this is the kind of thing create

[23:15] crisis and panic and it just has more

[23:17] people clamoring for the government to

[23:19] do something. For the government to fix

[23:22] it. Government overreach is the charge.

[23:25] What's the response? Oh, I

[23:27] you know, I No, not at all. Uh

[23:29] Uh when you think about where we were a

[23:31] week or 10 days ago, we had a new strain

[23:33] of flu, we didn't really know what it

[23:36] what it lethality was going to be, we

[23:38] didn't know how quickly it was going to

[23:40] move. Uh and so we had to move because

[23:43] once you get behind flu, you can't catch

[23:45] up. You have to get ahead of it. And uh

[23:47] we took as our number one guide, what

[23:49] what do the doctors tell us to do to to

[23:52] act for the safety of the American

[23:54] people. Now, as we go through it every

[23:56] day, we can adjust because they know a

[23:58] little more, they know a little more but

[24:00] quickly they know a little more about

[24:01] what actually happened in Mexico. So our

[24:03] guidance has been, you know, get

[24:05] prepared for the worst and be able to

[24:07] then adjust as we go as as we go through

[24:10] the actual cycle.

[24:11] >> today, we're ahead of it? Um today we

[24:13] have done, I think, everything that we

[24:15] we could do, yes.

[24:16] Thank you all very much. The round table

[24:18] is next with George Will, Jerry Seib,

[24:20] Gwen Ifill, and Paul Krugman. And later,

[24:22] the Sunday funnies. And President Obama

[24:25] got exactly the gift he wanted, an

[24:27] adorable new senator.

[24:30] I just hope he's housebroken.

[24:33] This week with George Stephanopoulos,

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[28:12] We will be right back with the round

[28:14] table and the Sunday funnies.

[28:16] >> [music]

[28:16] >> This Week with George Stephanopoulos

[28:19] from the New Zealand in Washington, D.C.

[28:22] will continue in a moment after this

[28:24] from [music] our ABC stations.

[28:28] Did you see that on Good Morning

[28:30] America? One day Diane's there with our

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[28:34] all across our country, all across the

[28:36] planet, breaking through, hey, like no

[28:38] one else. I mean, is there any door she

[28:40] can open? And Robin, she's like

[28:42] everywhere. Talk about making a

[28:43] difference. She's got the strength and

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[28:49] Well, that's Chris getting things done.

[28:52] All the while, Sam's out there knee deep

[28:54] in like every storm. Hey, no wonder they

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[28:59] >> [snorts]

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[30:02] >> [music]

[30:06] >> Mrs. Erickson is very proud to be an

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[30:13] Her class learns that Oregon has strong

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[30:35] >> Holding the powerful accountable, K2

[30:37] news is on your side. Philosophy and

[30:40] principle and all those wonderful

[30:42] sounding words. It has has cold craft

[30:45] political calculation. Michael Steele

[30:47] saying good riddance to Arlen Specter,

[30:48] Republican Senator became a Democrat

[30:50] this week bringing the Democrats one

[30:51] step closer to 60 in the Senate. Lots of

[30:55] different implications to that switch.

[30:57] We're going to talk about it on the

[30:57] round table today. Let me bring in

[30:59] George Will, Gerry Seib of the Wall

[31:01] Street Journal, Paul Krugman of the New

[31:02] York Times and Princeton, and Gwen Ifill

[31:04] of PBS. And I want to get to the

[31:06] Republican Party later George, but let's

[31:09] begin with the implications of this for

[31:11] the Supreme Supreme Court. Of course,

[31:12] Arlen Specter was the ranking Republican

[31:14] on the Judiciary Committee. He's out

[31:16] right now. And as this goes forward,

[31:18] we're going to learn a lot about

[31:20] President Obama, his party, and the

[31:22] Republican Party. We are. This will not

[31:24] change the balance on the court because

[31:26] this is a liberal being will be replaced

[31:28] by presumably a liberal. You may be

[31:30] admiring my necktie. I love your tie.

[31:32] >> That is the silhouette

[31:33] >> you going to tell me what it's about?

[31:34] The silhouette of James Madison. This is

[31:36] the tie of the Federalist Society. And

[31:38] when I wear it on television, sleepers

[31:40] and cells all over the country

[31:41] >> [laughter]

[31:43] >> go to war. But there there'll be no war

[31:44] over this. He has a majority. He's no

[31:46] fool. He will whoever he nominates will

[31:48] be confirmed. And then he may be

[31:50] disappointed because just as Souter

[31:53] disappointed

[31:54] George Herbert Walker Bush, just as

[31:56] Felix Frankfurter disappointed Franklin

[31:58] Roosevelt,

[31:59] these people take on lives of their own

[32:01] when they get on the

[32:01] >> George, you're saying there'll be no

[32:02] war. So let me bring in Gwen Ifill right

[32:04] here. I think George is probably right

[32:06] on that. Everything we know about

[32:07] President Obama shows a a temperate

[32:10] nature. Yet he is getting a lot of

[32:12] pressure already

[32:13] from liberals who say, "You know what?

[32:15] You've got You'll have 60 votes this

[32:18] summer. Go pick someone even if it means

[32:20] getting

[32:21] 30 Republican no votes."

[32:22] >> Because that's the way it works in

[32:24] Washington. There's always a war even if

[32:26] the outcome is predetermined about

[32:27] something like this. By the way,

[32:29] Justices Alito and Justices Roberts did

[32:30] not disappoint President George

[32:33] George W. Bush. So there's a lot to be

[32:35] said for and probably a longer track

[32:37] record of Supreme Court nominees who do

[32:40] do what is expected of them and that's

[32:41] why Well, Bryer and Ginsburg got

[32:43] overwhelming votes and they turned out

[32:44] to be pretty steadfast liberals over

[32:46] there.

[32:46] >> Well, I don't think anybody was confused

[32:48] that they were going to be pretty

[32:48] steadfast liberals. That was at a time

[32:50] when people thought it was the thing to

[32:51] do that unless this person, this nominee

[32:54] really was horrible and in some way was

[32:56] not worthy of the seat, you could gave

[32:58] the president his choice. That clearly

[33:00] is not what happens anymore and what

[33:02] really has to happen for these

[33:04] anybody that the president nominates not

[33:07] to be confirmed is, you know, especially

[33:09] with 60 votes now it looks like maybe

[33:11] perhaps in the Senate it would take a

[33:13] lot more. A personal problem.

[33:15] >> A personal problem, something and even

[33:17] and there are people on the court who

[33:18] had personal problems who still managed

[33:20] to get confirmed, so. I It would take a

[33:22] lot, but I think there's still going to

[33:23] be a fight because there's always a

[33:24] fight.

[33:24] >> Are you one of the liberals who wants a

[33:25] big fight? I'm not sure I would make the

[33:27] fight over this, but there are people

[33:28] certainly who who do. I mean,

[33:30] you know, Obama is having some problems

[33:32] with people who progressives who

[33:34] expected him to be more dramatically

[33:36] different than than he is. Who in some

[33:39] sense

[33:41] people are disappointed over Tim

[33:42] Geithner are going to be demanding a

[33:43] more liberal justice appointment because

[33:46] Obama has not

[33:48] you can say lots of good things even

[33:49] progressives will, but he has not been

[33:51] quite the crusader for liberal causes

[33:54] that a lot of people had hoped he'd be.

[33:55] >> And Jerry, I was talking to a White

[33:56] House official over the weekend and said

[33:58] the president's not looking to throw a

[33:59] grenade into the middle of this process,

[34:01] but he did lay out an interesting series

[34:03] of criteria very deliberate on Friday

[34:06] afternoon. Everyone's focusing

[34:08] on the empathy, but he also talked about

[34:10] integrity, excellence and respecting the

[34:12] rule of law. Right and he used the term

[34:13] independence of thought as well and

[34:15] you're right everybody's focusing on

[34:16] empathy because nobody's quite sure what

[34:17] that means. It It may be a code word for

[34:20] liberal activist which I think Senator

[34:21] Hatch told you just a few minutes ago.

[34:23] It may mean other people think a

[34:26] sign that he wants somebody who's not

[34:27] out of the judicial system now, somebody

[34:29] with more real world experience and for

[34:31] a governor perhaps, or somebody who's

[34:33] who's got sort of a gritty gritty feel

[34:35] for what's happening in America today,

[34:37] not a judicial feel for it. What is a

[34:39] liberal activist these days? Because

[34:41] until January 20th at noon, liberals

[34:44] wanted someone who would rein in

[34:46] presidential power. I'm not sure that's

[34:47] what this president wants anymore. So,

[34:49] liberals can be situational

[34:50] constitutionalists, too.

[34:52] Yeah. And then the president has said in

[34:54] the past, if you look back at his

[34:56] service in in the Senate, also during

[34:58] the campaign, that he does value people

[35:00] come from outside the judiciary

[35:02] on on the one hand, but also that he

[35:04] wants someone especially who will stand

[35:06] up against overreaching executive power.

[35:09] So, so it's going to be a fascinating

[35:11] series of hearings, but when it also

[35:13] will will

[35:14] I think set up a series of possible

[35:16] traps for both Democrats and

[35:18] Republicans. For Democrats, the the risk

[35:20] is overreach.

[35:21] Trying to to do too much. Trying to go

[35:24] too far with the pick. For the

[35:26] Republicans, could be put in a real box.

[35:29] Especially if President Obama picks, as

[35:31] some people think he will, the first

[35:33] Latino

[35:34] for the Supreme Court, who happens to

[35:36] also be a woman, Sonia Sotomayor, only

[35:38] one possibility. And actually, that

[35:40] would be very tempting for the president

[35:41] to do that, just to put them in that

[35:42] box. I mean, I find it kind of the whole

[35:44] situation to be kind of nice. It's nice

[35:46] to have a different

[35:48] a code word, empathy instead

[35:49] [clears throat] of litmus test, which

[35:50] has always been our code word before.

[35:52] And we never really knew what that

[35:53] meant, either. That was also one of

[35:54] those words or terms that was used

[35:57] depending on where you came from. So,

[35:58] yeah, they're both in a box. I do agree

[36:00] with Paul that the liberals really would

[36:02] like an opportunity to push this

[36:04] president a little bit more, because

[36:05] they don't think he has been

[36:06] sufficiently liberal to suit their

[36:08] taste, but I don't think they'll object

[36:09] to anything that he comes up with.

[36:11] >> And and in the short run, Paul, whoever

[36:12] he picks is not going to, as George

[36:14] suggested at the top, going to change

[36:16] the nature of the court dramatically,

[36:18] unless this person has a special ability

[36:20] to get Justice Kennedy to switch sides

[36:22] on most big issues.

[36:23] >> think about the timeline here. You know,

[36:25] just 4 years ago, we were looking at

[36:27] everyone was saying we have a permanent

[36:29] Republican majority. We're going to have

[36:31] a definitively conservative Supreme

[36:32] Court. It's really all going to change.

[36:34] And all that has changed now. So, yes,

[36:36] the person may not be more liberal than

[36:37] Souter, but the person will be younger

[36:39] than Souter. And so, we're going to end

[36:40] up with a and Obama will probably get

[36:43] other appointments. So, we're going to

[36:44] be looking at a court that is in fact

[36:46] not going to be that right-leaning court

[36:48] that almost everybody thought was

[36:50] inevitable.

[36:50] >> let me pick up on that because I know

[36:52] that the thinking in a lot of the

[36:53] circles around the administration is

[36:55] that this is the first of the three

[36:57] picks for the president. There's

[36:58] actually been a very elaborate

[36:59] sequencing worked out. Souter decided to

[37:02] retire only after he checked with

[37:04] Ginsburg and Stevens. Next year, either

[37:06] Ginsburg or Stevens will retire. The

[37:07] year after that, uh the last one will go

[37:09] when the president is expecting, no

[37:11] guarantee, but expecting three picks.

[37:13] >> I think that's right and you would just

[37:14] look at the actuarial tables going into

[37:16] the administration and think that that's

[37:17] a likely way to look at it and it

[37:19] actually enables President Obama to kind

[37:21] of strategize how he picks, what kinds

[37:23] of people he picks, knowing that the one

[37:25] pick isn't the last one, it's the first

[37:27] of several. But, it's also worth

[37:28] remembering, I think, that there's still

[37:29] going to be a fairly young conservative

[37:32] block on this court. You know, the the

[37:33] Roberts-Alito alignment is they're not

[37:35] going away anytime soon, either. So,

[37:37] this is going to be an interesting and

[37:39] an interesting time to remake the court

[37:41] or not remake the court, as you suggest.

[37:44] There's one other thing I would mention

[37:45] here that I think has gotten relatively

[37:46] little attention. You cannot have this

[37:49] hearing at this time and not have the

[37:50] abortion issue come up and it's really

[37:52] the first time in the Obama presidency

[37:53] when that has is going to be raised. And

[37:56] I'm not sure that's really what the

[37:57] White House wants to engage in a debate

[37:58] about right now, but you can't really

[38:00] avoid it. I was uh talking with a

[38:02] Republican, a conservative Republican

[38:04] senator earlier in the week and I asked

[38:06] him, I said, "When does abortion arise

[38:08] as an issue in this administration?" He

[38:09] said, "Not until there's a Supreme Court

[38:11] uh vacancy." And then 2 days later,

[38:13] there was a Supreme Court vacancy.

[38:14] >> night at his press conference when this

[38:15] question of the freedom of choice act

[38:17] which would codify Roe v. Wade come up,

[38:18] he He said, "Listen, I'm I'm for it, but

[38:20] it's just not my priority. I don't want

[38:22] to push it right now.

[38:24] Well,

[38:25] one thing the president could do here is

[38:27] to do something that would break the

[38:30] streak. Now, we have nine justices who

[38:33] are former appellate judges, and he

[38:35] could go for the Earl Warren model,

[38:37] someone from politics. Earl Warren

[38:39] famously would have a law come before

[38:41] him and constitutionality would be

[38:43] challenged, and he'd say, "Well, is the

[38:44] law right? Is it nice? Is it good?"

[38:47] Interesting questions, but not judicial

[38:49] questions. The question is, is it

[38:50] constitutional? There are lots of things

[38:52] that aren't right that are

[38:53] constitutional. He may do that, and I

[38:54] have to say as someone who's been in the

[38:55] middle of some of these meetings to to

[38:57] pick a justice, that is always the first

[38:59] inclination at the first meeting. You

[39:00] want something way outside of the box,

[39:02] something that, you know, someone in the

[39:03] Earl Warren model, and then the longer

[39:05] the process goes on, well, you go back

[39:06] to that appeals court.

[39:08] Every time it's happened, did you say

[39:09] nine times in a row?

[39:10] >> Cautionary word, Harriet Myers was

[39:12] outside the And outside the box as well.

[39:14] Let's Let's say switch subjects now.

[39:16] >> [laughter]

[39:17] >> Another fallout from the Specter switch,

[39:19] obviously, the question of what does

[39:21] this mean

[39:22] for the Republican Party. There's been a

[39:24] a lot of soul searching, even though

[39:25] Michael Steele and others going saying

[39:27] that this says a lot more about Arlen

[39:29] Specter than it does about the

[39:30] Republican Party. Yet, it comes at a

[39:32] time, according to our Washington

[39:34] Post-ABC News poll, that the Republican

[39:35] Party is at its lowest point in what, in

[39:37] 25 years?

[39:38] >> 21% people of people identify as

[39:40] Republicans anymore, which may have

[39:42] something to do with just sinking party

[39:43] identification all around. But, what's

[39:45] interesting about about this is the

[39:48] refreshing nature of Arlen Specter's

[39:50] admission. He said that

[39:52] He did say at some point, "Well, you

[39:54] know, the party left me. I didn't leave

[39:55] the party." But, then he went on to say,

[39:56] "I looked at my polls." A politician who

[39:58] admits that he reads the polls, even the

[40:00] president won't do that. We know that's

[40:01] not true. Um, he's admitting that he

[40:04] can't win. Now, what that also raises a

[40:06] question of is whether it's more

[40:07] important that he be reelected than that

[40:09] the Republican Party of Pennsylvania,

[40:11] however it's composed, be represented.

[40:13] Um, it's been a very interesting thing

[40:15] because I think the real thing you can

[40:17] tell about how concerned Republicans are

[40:19] are people like Kay Bailey Hutchison is

[40:21] not a raving liberal

[40:22] who says that she's worried about it.

[40:24] People like Lindsey Graham from the

[40:25] center of South Carolina who is not a

[40:27] raving liberal who says he is worried

[40:29] about it. He is worried about the

[40:30] direction of the party and what this

[40:31] says about it.

[40:32] >> And you've got a whole bunch of top

[40:33] Republicans including Mitt Romney, Jeb

[40:36] Bush, Eric Cantor of Virginia coming

[40:38] together, Haley Barbour of Mississippi

[40:39] coming together in a new group yesterday

[40:41] to talk about outreach for the

[40:42] Republican Party, rebranding the

[40:44] Republican Party. Here is Jeb Bush in

[40:46] northern Virginia. Our ideas need to be

[40:48] forward looking and relevant. Um I just

[40:51] I felt like there was a lot of nostalgia

[40:52] for the good old days in in in the

[40:54] messaging. Um

[40:56] and you know, it's great, but it doesn't

[40:58] it doesn't draw people towards your

[40:59] cause. The party clearly seems to be

[41:01] concerned at the top levels, George, of

[41:03] being branded as the party of no in in

[41:05] in in the wake of President Obama's

[41:08] election, but also having a hard time I

[41:10] it feels like when you talk about

[41:12] rebranding and outreach, you're avoiding

[41:14] the core question. Is this a problem

[41:16] that Republican ideas are out of favor

[41:18] or is it just a communications problem?

[41:20] Well, the scale of the problem can be

[41:21] measured this way. It is estimated that

[41:23] there are 10 states with only 93

[41:26] electoral votes in which the Republican

[41:28] Party is sort of durably strong. Now

[41:31] that's that's a regional party is what

[41:33] they're becoming. I happen to believe

[41:35] that no is a pretty good word in

[41:37] politics. Most beautiful five words in

[41:39] the English language are the first five

[41:41] words of the first amendment. Congress

[41:42] shall make no law, period. But beyond

[41:45] that, in fact, Mr. Obama, by the clarity

[41:48] of his program

[41:50] and the energy of his program, is going

[41:51] to help the Republicans redefine

[41:53] themselves. They are going to be in

[41:54] opposition to this, they're going to be

[41:56] a again a party of more limited

[41:58] government. And if Mr. Obama's program

[42:01] works, he wins. If not, the Republican

[42:02] revival is assured. But you know, just

[42:05] think about rebranding. So who do they

[42:06] get together to rebrand the Republican

[42:08] Party?

[42:09] Uh the brother of a much disliked

[42:11] ex-president whose popularity is falling

[42:13] since he's left office.

[42:14] Um, the guy who didn't get the

[42:15] Republican nomination. You know, it's

[42:17] not a

[42:18] um

[42:19] They don't have any very new faces to do

[42:20] this rebranding. And they are becoming a

[42:23] party that is shrinking in on itself.

[42:25] It's a kind of death spiral in which the

[42:27] moderates got driven out of the party,

[42:28] lost, and what's left is a more

[42:30] conservative party, which is getting

[42:33] further and further away from the

[42:34] mainstream. If Obama fails big time,

[42:36] maybe that works, but if not, they

[42:38] really have marginalized them.

[42:39] >> time Paul The last time they talked

[42:40] about the Republicans in a death spiral

[42:42] was after the '64 election, when

[42:45] Goldwater carried six states. Four years

[42:46] later, the Republicans began the string

[42:48] of winning 10 seven out of 10 elections.

[42:50] So, these death spirals can be reversed.

[42:52] >> That's true, but I mean, if you go look

[42:54] at the

[42:55] example of the Democrats in the 19

[42:57] 1980s, during the age of Reagan, they

[42:59] had to go through a similar experience

[43:01] to this, Jerry Seib. And that's where

[43:02] you saw the Democratic Leadership

[43:03] Council coming up with reform ideas. But

[43:05] it wasn't until And this picks up on

[43:07] Paul's point. It wasn't until there was

[43:09] a candidate, Bill Clinton, to carry

[43:11] those reform ideas forward that you

[43:12] actually saw uh the success. Right. And

[43:15] there's no obvious candidate for that

[43:16] spot in the Republican Party right now.

[43:18] But it it wouldn't be at this stage of

[43:19] the cycle. I think what's interesting

[43:21] about this particular fork in the road

[43:23] is that it's produced this debate among

[43:25] Republicans about whether the path back

[43:27] to health comes from having a more

[43:29] ideologically coherent conservative

[43:31] voice that implies a narrower base, or

[43:34] to spread out the party and have a

[43:35] bigger tent. Which is the best way back

[43:38] to power? Is it the having clarity of

[43:40] ideas, or a broader outreach? And I

[43:42] don't think that issue is resolved. And

[43:43] I think until it is, you're not going to

[43:45] know what the Republican Party that

[43:46] we're talking about really is going to

[43:48] be in the next two or three years.

[43:49] >> comes back to, Glenn, are the social

[43:51] issues. The Republicans can unify around

[43:54] a lot of economic issues, around the

[43:55] principle of liberty. But when you bring

[43:57] to the the social issues to the table,

[44:00] gay marriage, abortion, the environment

[44:03] to some extent, that's that's where a

[44:04] lot of of young Republicans are saying,

[44:06] we have to have

[44:07] more moderation here." Well, and that's

[44:09] the where the danger of those five words

[44:11] that that George was talking about

[44:13] comes, because it doesn't There's not a

[44:14] period after Congress shall make no law.

[44:16] It continues. And there I've been I

[44:18] spent the past week in St. Louis talking

[44:19] to people who kind of aren't in our

[44:21] bubble and are watching this very

[44:23] carefully. And who didn't necessarily

[44:24] vote for Barack Obama. I mean, Missouri

[44:26] is the one battleground state he didn't

[44:28] win. And they seem to be really patient

[44:30] with the possibility of government's

[44:32] role. Now, they're a little nervous

[44:33] about the deficits, a lot of folks.

[44:35] They're a little nervous about the

[44:35] spending. But, they're also saying,

[44:38] completely in in sync with the polls

[44:40] we've been reading, that they think

[44:42] maybe this might work. Or they don't

[44:44] know where else to go. But, I don't

[44:46] think telling these people that we're

[44:47] going to say no to everything, to every

[44:49] possible solution, uh is is is the is

[44:52] the message that Republicans really need

[44:54] to hear.

[44:54] >> solutions that's not so popular is one

[44:56] that he had to deal with this week. And

[44:58] it was the the the bankruptcy of

[45:00] Chrysler. And the president seemed quite

[45:02] defensive about the fact that the

[45:04] government was taking so many such a

[45:06] large stake in so many private

[45:08] businesses at his press conference on

[45:10] Wednesday. And then he was actually

[45:11] asked about what kind of a shareholder

[45:12] he would be.

[45:15] I don't want to run auto companies.

[45:18] I don't want to run banks.

[45:21] I've got two wars I've got to run

[45:23] already. But, I know that if the

[45:24] Japanese can design a affordable,

[45:27] well-designed hybrid,

[45:28] then doggone it, the American people

[45:30] should be able to do the same.

[45:33] So, my job is to

[45:35] ask

[45:36] the auto industry, "Why is it you guys

[45:38] can't do this?"

[45:40] I assume the president is talking about

[45:42] the Prius. It's affordable because

[45:44] Toyota sells it at a loss. And it can

[45:47] afford to sell it at a loss because it

[45:49] is selling twice as many gas-guzzling

[45:51] pickup trucks of the sort our president

[45:53] detests. So, as an auto executive, he's

[45:56] off to a rocky start. Now, let me ask

[45:57] people around this a question.

[46:00] If the UAW is going to own 39% of

[46:04] General Motors and the government's

[46:05] going to own 50%, how do you negotiate?

[46:08] Since you've got a government in part

[46:10] elected by the UAW negotiating with the

[46:12] UAW. And then there's Chrysler. If

[46:14] Chrysler's going to own be owned 55% by

[46:16] the UAW, is the UAW on both sides of the

[46:19] table when they negotiate a contract?

[46:20] >> Well, you know, this is ultimately all

[46:23] of this is going to depend on a

[46:24] continuing inflow of money from

[46:25] Washington. So ultimately, you know, the

[46:27] government is the shareholder. And

[46:28] that's that's the point in a way.

[46:31] In a way, that's probably going to

[46:32] ensure tougher bargains because

[46:34] this is tremendously unpopular.

[46:36] >> didn't have to drive a hard bargain. The

[46:37] UAW had to give a

[46:39] a lot of concessions.

[46:40] >> gotten significant wage cuts here. Now,

[46:42] it may not be enough. There's a problem.

[46:44] This is certainly not a problem. This is

[46:45] not something, you know, Obama wanted to

[46:47] do, but

[46:49] it was not conceivable to just let the

[46:51] thing collapse without without doing

[46:53] something, without at least delaying the

[46:54] process. This is I think mostly about

[46:56] making things move in slow enough motion

[46:58] that we might have an economic recovery

[47:00] before everything goes.

[47:01] >> And Jerry, the administration considers

[47:02] it I think a major victory that Chrysler

[47:04] they believe will

[47:06] be a viable company they hope when it

[47:07] comes out of bankruptcy. But the

[47:08] difficult question I think on on on on

[47:11] both Chrysler and GM is, okay, the

[47:13] government is in there now, but what

[47:15] everyone has to figure out is the exit

[47:17] strategy. And no one knows what that is.

[47:19] >> No, and and John Dingell, the the

[47:21] congressman from Michigan who's been

[47:22] around forever, told me when this all

[47:24] came up, he said, you know, I was I was

[47:26] a bankruptcy lawyer once. People forget

[47:27] how hard it is to get out of bankruptcy.

[47:29] It's much easier to go in than it is to

[47:31] get out, regardless of what people say

[47:33] at the at the moment like this when it

[47:34] all starts. So, I think the exit

[47:36] strategy is the question here. I don't

[47:38] know what it is. I'm not sure anybody

[47:39] knows what it is. But I I agree with

[47:41] Paul. I don't think Barack Obama wants

[47:43] to run auto companies, but that doesn't

[47:45] mean he's not going to be stuck doing it

[47:47] for a while. And I don't think he wants

[47:48] to tell the auto companies how to run

[47:50] their business per se, but it's pretty

[47:52] clear he does want to use his influence

[47:54] to convince them they ought to be making

[47:55] a different kind of car.

[47:56] >> was only he probably only got a deal

[47:59] when because he was willing to put

[48:00] bankruptcy on the table in a real way.

[48:03] And I was struck by how much leeway

[48:05] Michigan politicians who supported him

[48:07] were giving him on this. Well, and also

[48:09] I was struck by his decision to really

[48:11] lash out against hedge funds, which at

[48:13] is standing in front of a microphone

[48:14] with all of your economic team behind

[48:16] you. That's not a hard thing to do, I

[48:17] suppose. No one knows what hedge funds

[48:19] are and it sounds like an evil thing, so

[48:21] let's say it's a bad thing. But

[48:22] >> four times. I'm not on their side.

[48:24] >> Well, because he wasn't on their side,

[48:25] they weren't on his side. He had no

[48:26] choice but to put bankruptcy on the

[48:28] table. It's not like the president has

[48:30] had a wide array of choices here in

[48:31] trying to to stop this. Their way of

[48:34] looking at it is that there was not an

[48:35] option for failure for these auto

[48:36] companies. And so then if you assume

[48:38] there's no option that you're not you're

[48:40] not going to let them collapse, then

[48:41] what do you do? It seems to me the

[48:42] bankruptcy that we've sort of tried to

[48:45] pre-package in the administration before

[48:47] it goes to court is in the subjunctive

[48:49] mood. It will not be final until the

[48:51] judge speaks. And the president's

[48:53] proposing overturning certain premises

[48:54] of a bankruptcy law. Second, we talk

[48:57] about an exit strategy. 30 years ago

[48:59] today, Margaret Thatcher won the

[49:01] election that made her prime minister

[49:03] and we had the retreat of the state

[49:05] continued for almost 30 years. Now it's

[49:08] been reversed in a big way and I'm not

[49:10] convinced that once the political class

[49:12] comes to relish the pleasures of having

[49:14] this enormous slush fund to intervene in

[49:16] the economy,

[49:18] uh turning bank loans into shares in the

[49:21] banks, etc. I'm not sure they're going

[49:22] to want to exit at all.

[49:24] >> No, I can't predict, but right now, let

[49:25] me tell you they really don't want to

[49:27] run banks. They so badly don't want to

[49:29] run banks, I think it's actually kind of

[49:30] hamstringing their ability to deal with

[49:32] them because they don't they don't want

[49:33] to go where they just went with Chrysler

[49:34] on the banks. And this is this is you

[49:36] know, this is a definitely not a

[49:37] socialist-minded administration.

[49:39] >> So how do you get out though?

[49:41] You know, the only thing you can say is

[49:43] auto sales right now are so low that

[49:46] looking at the current situation is not

[49:47] a good guide. Right? At current rates of

[49:49] sales, it would take 27 years to replace

[49:51] the existing stock of automobiles. So,

[49:53] we know that automobiles, you know, cars

[49:55] don't last that long. So, automobile

[49:56] sales are going to go up. So, things are

[49:58] going to look better even if they do

[50:00] nothing, even if they just hold the

[50:01] fort. Not enough to make these going

[50:03] concerns as currently structured, but

[50:05] maybe it's going to be easier. You know,

[50:06] what looks impossible now may look

[50:09] doable in a year. You know, there's a

[50:11] interesting political effect that you

[50:13] referred to uh briefly, George, which is

[50:15] that in the White House people are sort

[50:17] of likening the president's willingness

[50:18] to use the bankruptcy threat and follow

[50:20] through on it here to Ronald Reagan's

[50:22] firing of the air traffic controllers to

[50:24] say that you show toughness, it has an

[50:26] effect on the immediate situation, it

[50:27] has a ripple effect down the line that

[50:29] it makes people realize you're willing

[50:31] to do tough things. Now, it may or may

[50:33] not turn out that way, but there's the

[50:34] potential here as messy as this current

[50:36] situation is to have a sort of a broader

[50:38] impact.

[50:39] >> hedge funds may be even less popular

[50:40] than the air traffic controllers were.

[50:42] That's almost certainly true.

[50:43] >> [laughter]

[50:44] >> 1981. And you know, George, we only have

[50:46] about a minute left, but the political

[50:48] world [clears throat]

[50:49] lost a star when the party lost one of

[50:50] its stars overnight. Jack Kemp, of

[50:52] course, former congressman, former vice

[50:54] presidential candidate, HUD secretary

[50:57] under Ronald Reagan succumbed to cancer

[50:59] last night. Uh

[51:01] He was a good friend of yours. He was a

[51:03] good friend. He was a good friend all

[51:04] all people who encountered him. He was a

[51:06] big-hearted man. Very strong

[51:08] convictions, but didn't know how to make

[51:09] an enemy and didn't know how to hold a

[51:11] grudge. He was just a terrific fellow.

[51:13] And and and always an optimist. And Gwen

[51:16] and I were talking before, didn't seem

[51:18] that possible he could be 73 cuz he was

[51:20] such a such a youthful guy and had that

[51:22] sort of youthful energy start to finish

[51:24] of his political career. I covered Jack

[51:25] Kemp when he was the secretary of HUD

[51:27] and also when he ran for vice president,

[51:28] and he was the original happy warrior

[51:30] for the Republicans as opposed to the

[51:32] Hubert Humphrey bolt. He was kind of

[51:33] that way. He really thought he could be

[51:35] elected vice president in 1988 when

[51:37] nobody else thought so. And he also

[51:39] thought he could expand the Republican

[51:40] Party and make a broader umbrella,

[51:42] something which has proven not to be so.

[51:43] And one of the nicest man you'll ever

[51:45] meet in politics. This round table is

[51:46] going to continue in the green room on

[51:48] abcnews.com and we come back when we

[51:50] come back more of remembering Jack Kemp.

[51:52] Literally, people are drowning out there

[51:54] from excessive taxes.

[51:57] The round table is brought to you by

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[53:30] just arrived, and the groom is He's

[53:32] getting cold feet. I'm okay. No, I'm

[53:33] not. Look, we got to go now. The light's

[53:35] perfect.

[53:35] >> the stunt crew now. What's the stunt

[53:37] crew?

[53:40] >> [music]

[53:41] >> Jackpot.

[53:43] Get work done now. Nextel Direct Connect

[53:46] with GPS tracking only on the Now

[53:48] network.

[53:48] >> Men go to work, make money, support the

[53:50] family. But when the pink slip comes,

[53:52] [music] with layoffs hitting men harder

[53:54] than women, the traditional male-female

[53:55] roles are getting a forced makeover. So

[53:58] who's the breadwinner these days? The

[53:59] new gender rules, Monday [music] on

[54:01] World News with Charles Gibson.

[54:10] Now

[54:10] >> [music]

[54:10] >> in the morning.

[54:13] I was fulfilled

[54:14] quite easily in terms of going from

[54:16] football competition to political

[54:19] competition.

[54:21] >> [music]

[54:30] >> The entire world is looking to America

[54:33] for inspiration and leadership. More

[54:35] than ever

[54:36] we are the bright signal in an otherwise

[54:39] dark night.

[54:41] >> [music]

[54:44] >> I shall not seek and I will not accept

[54:47] the nomination of my party for another

[54:49] term as your president.

[54:52] >> [music]

[55:01] >> This [music] week the Pentagon released

[55:02] the names of five service members killed

[55:04] in Iraq.

[55:11] >> [music]

[55:17] >> We'll be right back.

[55:22] I'm Mo and this is my Citgo. [music]

[55:25] Corpus Christi is growing a lot. Yet we

[55:27] all come together to make this town a

[55:29] better place. I give back by helping

[55:31] kids make better choices. And to keep

[55:33] [music] growing, our community depends

[55:35] on Citgo for reliable supply of fuel and

[55:38] everything else it needs to keep moving.

[55:40] Every Citgo is locally owned and they're

[55:43] at every turn. My Citgo plays [music] a

[55:45] vital role in this neighborhood. We're

[55:47] local and loyal like it should be.

[55:51] >> [music]

[55:51] >> At Verizon Wireless, we understand that

[55:53] training and teamwork are what move our

[55:55] people forward.

[55:56] Like the training that lets me help

[55:58] customers with new wireless innovations.

[56:01] >> [music]

[56:02] >> And to help us reach our goals, nothing

[56:04] succeeds like the power of teamwork.

[56:08] Training [music] and teamwork to make

[56:09] jobs into careers.

[56:12] At Verizon Wireless, we're learning

[56:13] [music] and working together so we work

[56:15] better for our customers.

[56:20] What has made Grant Thornton one of the

[56:22] largest accounting organizations in the

[56:24] world? With [music] resources in more

[56:26] than 100 countries worldwide.

[56:28] Is it their expertise and partner

[56:30] involvement?

[56:32] Global capabilities?

[56:33] And extraordinary audit, tax, and

[56:36] advisory services?

[56:39] Or is it their passion for how they

[56:41] serve their clients?

[56:43] Grant Thornton. Find out what it's like

[56:46] to work with people who love what they

[56:48] do.

[56:50] All new.

[56:52] ABC tonight. As a soldier, he nearly

[56:55] [music] sacrificed his life, but he

[56:57] still fights the battle for other

[56:59] disabled veterans. He's changed laws. He

[57:02] deserves a place that reflects that.

[57:05] With the honorable Colin Powell, a

[57:07] tribute to a military [music] hero.

[57:09] >> I can't wait to show you what's going on

[57:10] in this bus. It really is going to give

[57:11] you back your independence

[57:13] and your pride. ABC's Extreme Makeover:

[57:16] Home Edition, all new tonight 8:00 7:00

[57:18] Central on ABC. There's nothing like all

[57:21] new episodes of your favorite shows.

[57:23] Tonight the housewives are hooking up.

[57:25] Every night for 30 days.

[57:26] >> it quick.

[57:28] Making up. Marry me. And breaking up.

[57:31] I'm doing whatever needs to be done. An

[57:33] all new Desperate Housewives and it's a

[57:35] couple's showdown. Did you? Did I what?

[57:38] Sleep with him? And a husband's throw

[57:40] down.

[57:40] >> do everything to protect my marriage and

[57:42] I'm a very powerful man.

[57:44] >> An all new Brothers [music] and Sisters

[57:45] it's all new tonight starting at 9:08

[57:47] Central on ABC.

[57:53] It turns out that the Sunday Funnies

[57:54] tuned into my interview with the Iranian

[57:56] president.

[57:58] I'm a dinner jacket. He he he uh

[58:00] complained that President Obama hasn't

[58:02] been returning his messages.

[58:05] No offense, Mahmoud. Maybe he's just not

[58:07] that into you, you know?

[58:10] >> [laughter]

[58:10] >> Republican Senator Arlen Specter

[58:14] has contracted donkey flu.

[58:18] Folks, this disease is now officially

[58:21] out of control.

[58:23] Back in 2004, we thought we had it

[58:25] contained to the coast and the cities,

[58:27] but then it mutated and tore through the

[58:30] country.

[58:31] >> [cheering]

[58:32] >> Biden has been speaking out so much

[58:34] lately. Today President Obama took some

[58:36] action. Did you see them together? Take

[58:37] a look. You see look he's got duct tape.

[58:39] Look, you see him?

[58:42] He's the first president ever who can

[58:44] use Facebook, but his staff does not

[58:45] know how to use Photoshop. Here's how it

[58:47] works, [laughter] by the way.

[58:49] This is the Statue of Liberty and look

[58:51] at them. Voila, here's Air Force One

[58:54] flying by.

[58:56] Look what else we can do here. We can

[58:57] have President Obama actually walking on

[58:59] the

[59:02] And that's our show for today. Thanks

[59:03] for sharing part of your Sunday with us.

[59:05] We'll see you next week.

[59:07] >> [music]

[59:13] [music]

[59:19] [music]

[59:24] >> From probable to confirmed, the next

[59:27] stage in the swine flu locally. New

[59:29] information about the person killed in

[59:31] our area's brief but powerful storm. The

[59:34] mystery of the missing parent. We just

[59:37] want Savannah.

[59:38] We want to get her to the vet and make

[59:40] sure she's okay. The lengths a local

[59:42] family has gone to in reclaiming their

[59:45] prized bird, even getting help from a

[59:47] pet detective.

[59:50] >> [music]

[59:51] >> Live at 5:00. This is K2 News on your

[59:55] side.

[59:56] Good evening everyone. Thanks for

[59:57] joining us. I'm Anna Song. Oregon now

[60:00] has its first three confirmed case alone

[60:02] does not make you rich. It's your

[60:04] financial intelligence that make you

[60:06] rich, and that's why the rich are

[60:07] getting richer.

[60:11] I would absolutely [music] recommend

[60:12] Rich Dad education to others.

[60:15] It's time for you to get smarter with

[60:17] your money.

[60:22] New information and updated stories. K2

[60:24] News 11 on your side.